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[Music]

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10 9 8 7 6

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[Music]

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[Applause]

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[Music]

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good afternoon ladies and gentlemen to

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the program I'm your host uh Chris at

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Georgia Zoo gran this is the den of lore

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and we are live for episode 105 and this

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is Thursday August 8 2018 and ladies and

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gentlemen do we have a show on for you

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tonight or this afternoon depending on

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where you are and again don't forget to

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check us out on our various social media

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and audio outlet distribution channels

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whether you're on YouTube periscope

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twitch TV periscope a my own personal

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Facebook live Spreaker den of lore comms

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audio stream or any of the other

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syndicated radio stations that we are on

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and again a quick shout out also to our

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friends at copacetic productions who

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just had a very interesting three-day

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festival I told them I would give them

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all the love in the world so all you

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guys out there if you were absent

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aptly-named summer festival I was good

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to see you out there and I had a blast

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and also a special thank you to our

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patrons who keep us on the air keep us

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corporate sponsor free and able to say

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whatever we want

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on air well almost anything you know at

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least be able to keep the subject matter

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free and honest and if weren't for you

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guys that we would not exist so a

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special thank you to go to

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patreon.com/scishow and support for as

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little as $1 a month and if you want to

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be able to get in on the after show

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that'll be happening at 7 p.m. Eastern

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Standard Time or at 4 p.m. Pacific

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you're more than welcome to join us and

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I want to give a special special shout

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out to our patrons as we do with the

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start of every show our illustrious

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master Pat from Brooklyn and her masters

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Elizabeth Audrey rob W Jackie from

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across the pond Eric

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rocky jenny Dora merely Chuck Schwartz

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Jared mrs. Fox

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Joshua Wayne and our den mother Ellen

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and to her fellow craft Kathleen Eclipse

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photopic Nick Venise Charles hobby T hot

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and her entered apprentices slower boat

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mark Mike fee on go Dean John Anthony

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and her patrons Dennis Eric Oh Katie

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Christopher M and Robin another Patriot

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you can go to Matt you can get master

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level now for only $9 a month and it

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gets you cool stuff like access

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- our master class early episodes

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whenever I send them out if such as the

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vacation I'm about to take in a couple

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of days you guys get those first and you

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know things like after shows what's your

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private to you guys because you're

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awesome so thank you very much

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welcoming on to the show is a good I'm

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gonna say becoming a good friend of mine

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we've been on a very good clip the last

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little while and I respect his work and

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it's one of those things where it

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doesn't matter if you don't see eye to

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eye on everything when the awesomeness

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level of the individual rises above the

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rest difference of opinions doesn't

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matter because you just enjoy their

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company

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Walter Bosley how are you doing today

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doing good Chris it's always good to be

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here I enjoy talking with you well thank

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you this is the third time you've been

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in the den the second time on at your

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own and you were you at that you would

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you were sitting on that chair the last

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time but you had the camera angled so

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it's good to be able to see that that

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painting i oh yeah the one of my

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paintings that i collected in my

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traveling days and I have several around

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the house now this isn't this isn't the

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only interest you have obviously

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otherwise you rent you wouldn't be here

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or you would be for just talking about

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art and I haven't done this in a while

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so I'd like to give you this honor which

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is to read your bio if if no would

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Walter Bosley is an investigative

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investigator of historical occult

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mysteries author of pulp fiction novels

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and a screenwriter who has appeared on

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History Channel's ancient aliens after

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19 years in the National Security Walter

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Bosley is a licensed private

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investigator in California where he has

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also runs a small press publishing

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company lost continent library founded

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in 2002 Bosley has traveled much of the

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world both on the job and off including

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the trips through Mexico and South

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America with David Hatcher Childress

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who's wvx magazine has published

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articles by Bosley Walter Bosley was in

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was born in San Diego California and

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attended SDSU where he earned a BA in

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journalism he has been employed by the

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Federal Bureau of Investigation's is an

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inactive reserve officer in the US Air

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Force and for which he served as a

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special agent of the AF OSI while on

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active duty and

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worked as a commuter terrorism

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operations consultant for six years

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following military service balls he

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spends his time reading fiction and

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nonfiction as well as investigating

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strange mysteries in between p.i

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assignments the latest news about

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Bosley's projects can be found at the

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following web site which is empire of

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the wheeled up blog spot.com

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and lost continent library dot blog

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spot.com and those are in the show notes

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mr. Bosley welcome to the den thank you

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thank you um the probably the the best

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place to keep up on my most recent stuff

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is in the social media Twitter and

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Facebook the blogs don't get as much

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attention as often as those other things

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do so they're still there they're still

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alive but also look for me and Twitter

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and Facebook now you have a couple of

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things that are coming up and obviously

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with the titleist something big is

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coming I know that one of the things we

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wanted to address is the company that

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shall not be named which has been having

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some issues possibly of late whether

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either through PR or through planning or

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basic operations or you know things like

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internet security and I know that you

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are one of the individuals that we had

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on when we first dropped our round take

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big roundtable from last year and from

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the company that shall not be named and

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you were the big name on that panel and

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you know if something big is coming like

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it shouldn't we get ready for it like do

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I need to sell my stuff yeah you know

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you might want to consider uh like what

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do they do sell the house get a motor

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home you know do all those things

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because once again it's the it's it's

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the coming of something whether it's the

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second coming of this or disclosure

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coming you know that it's something

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something's up never seems to happen but

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it's always up well it usually happens

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around you know someone's possible book

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release or the latest video drop or what

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have you and it

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and again you have several books that

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are coming up as well so I can't speak

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badly about that but there's a

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difference between your social media

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hype machine which seems to be based

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around actually uncovering information

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versus we have some information it's in

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this vial that is blacked out you don't

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know what it is and you know we may talk

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about it soon whereas you're talking

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directly about your research going into

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into your work right yeah you know I

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talk about what I write in the book I

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promote the fact that I have a book out

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and it's specifically you know the

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things that are that are in the book you

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know that when the books available you

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can choose to get the book and there it

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is and you know people want to have me

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on to talk about it I don't want to talk

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about it but I try to well I don't think

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I do this thing where I say hey I've got

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some information I'm not gonna tell you

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what it is but just have faith just

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trust me

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I've got it and that's what characters

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in the UFO community have done for

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decades not just the UFO community but

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in particular that UFO community and you

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know once again we're at a place in time

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when there's a whole bunch of people

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that are drinking the kool-aid not

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wanting to hear from others who quite

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frankly know better now isn't at least a

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good thing that the UFO phenomena is

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being discussed on a on a wide field it

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isn't the PR factor justification enough

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no I you know I'm gonna say that

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everybody brings that up and and a lot

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of people kind of go oh well I guess

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you're right

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well you know what I disagree with that

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you know saying anything just because it

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gets the conversation going and just

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because you know even bad news is good

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PR or whatever I disagree with that

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because and I think you know this

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depending upon what's being bandied

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about just to get the conversation going

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can be very damaging to the particular

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field you know of study or invest

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Asian or any attempt to you know bring

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some credibility to it so no I'm I

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disagree with the people that say hey

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whether it's true or not whether they're

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telling the truth or not whether it pans

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out or not at least people are talking

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about it you know okay

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people have been talking about this

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subject I would venture to say since the

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x-files came out the same amount of

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people are talking about UFOs are now

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one of the things that these particular

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true believers bring up is yeah but but

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look at the New York Times articles look

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at this it's never been in the

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mainstream media like that that is

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flat-out not true I got into this

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discussion with somebody and during the

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discussion I did just simple Google

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searches okay

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and I provided them with link after link

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going back you know 30 40 years where

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the mainstream media was doing you know

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reports on their evening news and you

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know big magazines big newspaper so

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there's nothing there's nothing new

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about what we're talking about here

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going on it's just a maybe a little bit

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of a different costume but the basic

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thing that's going on what we're

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discussing here it's it's really

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happened before and nothing came of it

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but a bunch of disappointment for people

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who desperately wanted to believe it you

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know somebody said you know the actor

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going back to the x-files it popularized

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the phrase I want to believe well now

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unfortunately the phrase is you know I

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need to believe or I'm going to believe

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and we'll just have to see we'll just

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have to see where it falls this time but

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you know my opinion is don't hold your

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breath for any kind of big disclosure I

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think the the word tsunami has been used

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and you know I've heard certain

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individuals connected with this

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organization that we'd rather not give

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any more publicity to I've even heard

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him recently say all it's come

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it's common and you know yikes here we

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go again

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00:14:42,000 --> 00:14:39,640
now in this is one thing that we talked

276
00:14:43,920 --> 00:14:42,010
about last night on on spaced-out radios

277
00:14:46,890 --> 00:14:43,930
reality of paranormal segment with Chris

278
00:14:49,170 --> 00:14:46,900
Cogswell and so I just want to give a

279
00:14:54,510 --> 00:14:49,180
quick shadow to those guys as well great

280
00:14:55,770 --> 00:14:54,520
team with with that sign of asking good

281
00:14:57,870 --> 00:14:55,780
questions that I think we've we've

282
00:15:00,150 --> 00:14:57,880
stumbled on one very important thing

283
00:15:02,520 --> 00:15:00,160
which is if you have such a crack team

284
00:15:04,470 --> 00:15:02,530
and I've heard the term crack team the

285
00:15:06,270 --> 00:15:04,480
team itself is not built around what

286
00:15:10,650 --> 00:15:06,280
they're claiming that they can do which

287
00:15:12,210 --> 00:15:10,660
is reverse engineering UFOs there are no

288
00:15:16,610 --> 00:15:12,220
biologists there are people who deal

289
00:15:19,950 --> 00:15:16,620
with you know smaller organisms the

290
00:15:21,810 --> 00:15:19,960
stranger organisms you know severe

291
00:15:24,180 --> 00:15:21,820
injuries to you know various parts of

292
00:15:26,640 --> 00:15:24,190
the body etc etc and the only individual

293
00:15:28,590 --> 00:15:26,650
who has an aerospace and example isn't a

294
00:15:31,440 --> 00:15:28,600
at least doesn't have a title to their

295
00:15:35,190 --> 00:15:31,450
name but seem to have run a particular

296
00:15:38,040 --> 00:15:35,200
you know dark program area of a certain

297
00:15:42,360 --> 00:15:38,050
aerospace company and their security guy

298
00:15:43,560 --> 00:15:42,370
you know bran ran his website apparently

299
00:15:45,210 --> 00:15:43,570
with a lot of information on it and

300
00:15:48,990 --> 00:15:45,220
didn't even bother to install security

301
00:15:51,690 --> 00:15:49,000
software so this craft team is starting

302
00:15:53,730 --> 00:15:51,700
to look less and less like you know the

303
00:15:57,570 --> 00:15:53,740
the Patriots have beat the Atlanta

304
00:16:01,080 --> 00:15:57,580
Falcons and more like you know the

305
00:16:05,450 --> 00:16:01,090
Browns are the Bears that went 0-1 13 or

306
00:16:08,810 --> 00:16:05,460
14 what it is is the crack team is

307
00:16:14,730 --> 00:16:08,820
showing a lot of cracks in their

308
00:16:18,450 --> 00:16:14,740
structure in their team yeah this is the

309
00:16:23,190 --> 00:16:18,460
it you know what can we say it's it's

310
00:16:25,710 --> 00:16:23,200
just it is at the same time this is my

311
00:16:28,380 --> 00:16:25,720
analysis of this it's at the same time

312
00:16:30,840 --> 00:16:28,390
yes we know it's a company okay with the

313
00:16:32,610 --> 00:16:30,850
product you know so far what I think

314
00:16:35,850 --> 00:16:32,620
they're pushing books right isn't

315
00:16:37,860 --> 00:16:35,860
lavinda writing the series of books

316
00:16:40,590 --> 00:16:37,870
associated with this so that's something

317
00:16:42,090 --> 00:16:40,600
again yeah that's the actual market

318
00:16:46,030 --> 00:16:42,100
product that's on the market at this

319
00:16:51,819 --> 00:16:46,040
point and you know the rest of it

320
00:16:55,360 --> 00:16:51,829
is is just height for something that you

321
00:16:58,420 --> 00:16:55,370
know there's no substance and what the

322
00:17:02,590 --> 00:16:58,430
people who are believing it point to a

323
00:17:04,990 --> 00:17:02,600
substance are these questionable you

324
00:17:07,689 --> 00:17:05,000
know reports of alleged UFO activity and

325
00:17:09,610 --> 00:17:07,699
people immediately question that and

326
00:17:12,280 --> 00:17:09,620
point out the flaws in these things and

327
00:17:14,500 --> 00:17:12,290
the believers come back and say like we

328
00:17:16,720 --> 00:17:14,510
said a moment ago well at least it's

329
00:17:18,850 --> 00:17:16,730
keeping the conversation alive so it

330
00:17:20,949 --> 00:17:18,860
makes me wonder you know what really is

331
00:17:24,669 --> 00:17:20,959
the game being played here even with the

332
00:17:28,960 --> 00:17:24,679
followers okay I I'm beginning to detect

333
00:17:32,110 --> 00:17:28,970
kind of a snarky wink from even the

334
00:17:36,100 --> 00:17:32,120
followers this tha's they what they do

335
00:17:38,890 --> 00:17:36,110
when you point out the flaws and what

336
00:17:41,350 --> 00:17:38,900
they're following when you point out the

337
00:17:44,190 --> 00:17:41,360
problems with what they're pushing they

338
00:17:50,799 --> 00:17:44,200
add they back up and they adopt this

339
00:17:53,710 --> 00:17:50,809
snarky smirky confidence and you know

340
00:17:56,230 --> 00:17:53,720
they say you know but hey it's getting

341
00:18:00,070 --> 00:17:56,240
the conversation going more people are

342
00:18:03,850 --> 00:18:00,080
talking about it so you know I'm

343
00:18:07,149 --> 00:18:03,860
wondering what's going on here now you

344
00:18:10,270 --> 00:18:07,159
have the clearly the business side of

345
00:18:12,760 --> 00:18:10,280
the particular organization but you also

346
00:18:16,600 --> 00:18:12,770
have strongly the potential for this

347
00:18:20,440 --> 00:18:16,610
organization being used for perception

348
00:18:22,720 --> 00:18:20,450
management you know by particular Intel

349
00:18:25,510 --> 00:18:22,730
agencies isn't it interesting that when

350
00:18:29,020 --> 00:18:25,520
you look at windows of time well you

351
00:18:33,190 --> 00:18:29,030
know let's go back to 2013 14 and 15

352
00:18:35,200 --> 00:18:33,200
there were a couple of guys putting

353
00:18:36,730 --> 00:18:35,210
together some secret space program

354
00:18:39,909 --> 00:18:36,740
conferences we've talked about those

355
00:18:43,090 --> 00:18:39,919
here before I spoke at the one in 2015 I

356
00:18:46,960 --> 00:18:43,100
went as a personal consultant from one

357
00:18:49,600 --> 00:18:46,970
of the speakers in 2014 and the speakers

358
00:18:52,919 --> 00:18:49,610
that those events were what you would

359
00:18:56,560 --> 00:18:52,929
call nuts and bolts actual numbers

360
00:18:59,529 --> 00:18:56,570
looking for documentation kind of real

361
00:19:03,129 --> 00:18:59,539
world researchers okay and

362
00:19:06,159 --> 00:19:03,139
it was gaining ground each year the

363
00:19:08,739 --> 00:19:06,169
attendance was higher and it was being

364
00:19:10,899 --> 00:19:08,749
talked about and it was approaching you

365
00:19:12,129 --> 00:19:10,909
know the research and investigation into

366
00:19:15,369 --> 00:19:12,139
the idea that there's a secret space

367
00:19:18,489 --> 00:19:15,379
program possibly breakaways but it

368
00:19:20,649 --> 00:19:18,499
mostly focused on where can we find the

369
00:19:24,369 --> 00:19:20,659
actual real-world evidence for secret

370
00:19:29,560 --> 00:19:24,379
space program and by the time they got

371
00:19:32,289 --> 00:19:29,570
to 2015 you had not the organization in

372
00:19:33,759 --> 00:19:32,299
question but the other one that I refer

373
00:19:34,419 --> 00:19:33,769
to as the circus you know who I'm

374
00:19:37,899 --> 00:19:34,429
talking about

375
00:19:40,810 --> 00:19:37,909
the whistleblower circus they burst onto

376
00:19:45,249 --> 00:19:40,820
the scene trying to wrest the spotlight

377
00:19:47,830 --> 00:19:45,259
you know desperately from the what I

378
00:19:51,039 --> 00:19:47,840
call quite frankly the legitimate SSP

379
00:19:52,779 --> 00:19:51,049
you know research that group that was

380
00:19:55,180 --> 00:19:52,789
getting you know getting the attention

381
00:19:57,369 --> 00:19:55,190
and then shortly after that they were

382
00:19:59,830 --> 00:19:57,379
followed by the appearance of the

383
00:20:03,759 --> 00:19:59,840
particular organization that we're

384
00:20:08,139 --> 00:20:03,769
talking about now then after that

385
00:20:10,899 --> 00:20:08,149
organization emerged you have the

386
00:20:13,810 --> 00:20:10,909
president of the US announcing that

387
00:20:15,969 --> 00:20:13,820
we're going to have a space force which

388
00:20:18,219 --> 00:20:15,979
personally nobody has to agree with this

389
00:20:19,810 --> 00:20:18,229
personally I've written this I've talked

390
00:20:22,180 --> 00:20:19,820
about it before I think we've had this

391
00:20:25,389 --> 00:20:22,190
space force since the 1950s that's

392
00:20:28,330 --> 00:20:25,399
that's its roots and we can get in later

393
00:20:30,669 --> 00:20:28,340
too no I don't think it's like Starfleet

394
00:20:33,339 --> 00:20:30,679
okay folks it's not that advanced but I

395
00:20:36,729 --> 00:20:33,349
think it one has existed since the 50s

396
00:20:40,089 --> 00:20:36,739
so I see that as maybe we're reaching a

397
00:20:42,489 --> 00:20:40,099
time when they're about to find a way to

398
00:20:45,190 --> 00:20:42,499
just kind of open it up a little bit and

399
00:20:47,289 --> 00:20:45,200
say hey here's what we have by but at

400
00:20:49,299 --> 00:20:47,299
first presenting and pretending that

401
00:20:51,039 --> 00:20:49,309
it's it's new we're just gonna do it and

402
00:20:53,950 --> 00:20:51,049
what's interesting is this particular

403
00:20:57,129 --> 00:20:53,960
organization we're talking about emerges

404
00:20:59,349 --> 00:20:57,139
on the public scene not long in terms of

405
00:21:02,649 --> 00:20:59,359
months before this announcement is made

406
00:21:04,810 --> 00:21:02,659
so going back to my opinion that there's

407
00:21:07,389 --> 00:21:04,820
perception management going on you have

408
00:21:09,310 --> 00:21:07,399
this organization if the Intel agencies

409
00:21:11,859 --> 00:21:09,320
and defense or whatever of the United

410
00:21:13,570 --> 00:21:11,869
States is using this organization for

411
00:21:17,169 --> 00:21:13,580
perception manage

412
00:21:19,240 --> 00:21:17,179
it could be something a program that's

413
00:21:22,840 --> 00:21:19,250
going hand-in-hand with whatever the

414
00:21:25,390 --> 00:21:22,850
reveal / announcement of the official

415
00:21:26,380 --> 00:21:25,400
space force is okay this is how these

416
00:21:28,480 --> 00:21:26,390
things work

417
00:21:31,330 --> 00:21:28,490
you know they they go out there the

418
00:21:33,490 --> 00:21:31,340
point man for getting things out there

419
00:21:37,779 --> 00:21:33,500
they want to steer it in a particular

420
00:21:40,600 --> 00:21:37,789
way and then og you know in the in the

421
00:21:42,909 --> 00:21:40,610
real world gosh here we have the space

422
00:21:44,770 --> 00:21:42,919
force which we've probably had you know

423
00:21:47,830 --> 00:21:44,780
a lot longer than they care to admit

424
00:21:50,110 --> 00:21:47,840
now some conspiracy minded people will

425
00:21:53,640 --> 00:21:50,120
ask what be the point of perception

426
00:21:58,060 --> 00:21:53,650
management on that well if we are to

427
00:22:00,909 --> 00:21:58,070
consider the Carol rosin story about

428
00:22:05,230 --> 00:22:00,919
what Werner von Braun you know allegedly

429
00:22:07,390 --> 00:22:05,240
said about you know the the different

430
00:22:09,880 --> 00:22:07,400
ways they're going to control the

431
00:22:11,830 --> 00:22:09,890
perception of the masses you know one of

432
00:22:15,730 --> 00:22:11,840
those ways the ultimate way remember was

433
00:22:19,480 --> 00:22:15,740
a so called alien invasion okay that's

434
00:22:21,549 --> 00:22:19,490
according to the the lore of the von

435
00:22:24,549 --> 00:22:21,559
braun you know so-called deathbed

436
00:22:27,640 --> 00:22:24,559
confessions story okay so let's bring it

437
00:22:30,370 --> 00:22:27,650
back you have this organization that has

438
00:22:34,210 --> 00:22:30,380
emerged and they have real former Intel

439
00:22:36,640 --> 00:22:34,220
guys and they're pushing the you know

440
00:22:39,909 --> 00:22:36,650
these things are from another world

441
00:22:43,630 --> 00:22:39,919
narrative shortly before it's announced

442
00:22:45,850 --> 00:22:43,640
we're gonna have a space force so one of

443
00:22:49,450 --> 00:22:45,860
two things emerged or implied from this

444
00:22:52,210 --> 00:22:49,460
either there really is some type of

445
00:22:56,409 --> 00:22:52,220
threat in space or presence in space

446
00:23:00,430 --> 00:22:56,419
that is driving the reveal of this space

447
00:23:07,149 --> 00:23:00,440
force okay or it's a theme that's about

448
00:23:08,350 --> 00:23:07,159
to be used okay to push the idea of you

449
00:23:09,850 --> 00:23:08,360
know the fact that's going to cost a lot

450
00:23:14,220 --> 00:23:09,860
of money or it already has caused a lot

451
00:23:17,140 --> 00:23:14,230
of money you know to the public okay so

452
00:23:19,060 --> 00:23:17,150
what I'm saying is either this

453
00:23:21,669 --> 00:23:19,070
particular organization we're talking

454
00:23:24,820 --> 00:23:21,679
about is part of pushing the alien

455
00:23:28,289 --> 00:23:24,830
invasion agenda of the Wernher von Braun

456
00:23:32,440 --> 00:23:30,970
it's just time for whatever reason that

457
00:23:35,440 --> 00:23:32,450
they want to reveal that we have a

458
00:23:39,820 --> 00:23:35,450
secret space program and you know it's

459
00:23:41,289 --> 00:23:39,830
part of that for some reason and I I can

460
00:23:42,789 --> 00:23:41,299
totally understand that from perception

461
00:23:44,230 --> 00:23:42,799
management standpoint and I know that

462
00:23:48,400 --> 00:23:44,240
we've we've had discussions about this

463
00:23:51,220 --> 00:23:48,410
before I'm coming from a media

464
00:23:54,190 --> 00:23:51,230
background there there's totally seems

465
00:23:55,840 --> 00:23:54,200
to be a perception management operation

466
00:23:58,419 --> 00:23:55,850
going on whether it is because they have

467
00:24:00,400 --> 00:23:58,429
individuals who do have an intelligence

468
00:24:02,830 --> 00:24:00,410
background who are working there or it's

469
00:24:04,690 --> 00:24:02,840
part of the overall you know perception

470
00:24:07,740 --> 00:24:04,700
management plan that is being planned by

471
00:24:09,820 --> 00:24:07,750
the government but I've spoken with

472
00:24:12,970 --> 00:24:09,830
individuals whom have written articles

473
00:24:14,320 --> 00:24:12,980
regarding this organization or at least

474
00:24:15,640 --> 00:24:14,330
a French organization in there and there

475
00:24:19,140 --> 00:24:15,650
was a particular pattern that is always

476
00:24:21,760 --> 00:24:19,150
emerging which is they will approach the

477
00:24:23,230 --> 00:24:21,770
outlet with this story and most outlets

478
00:24:24,490 --> 00:24:23,240
will just kind of him and haunt say okay

479
00:24:27,280 --> 00:24:24,500
this is kind of interesting or you know

480
00:24:29,080 --> 00:24:27,290
whatever it may get some clicks but who

481
00:24:31,090 --> 00:24:29,090
cares and then they like juice it up

482
00:24:32,590 --> 00:24:31,100
with saying we have the person who saw

483
00:24:35,530 --> 00:24:32,600
the event as well as the person who ran

484
00:24:36,970 --> 00:24:35,540
though the government program and the

485
00:24:39,510 --> 00:24:36,980
company will then our organization will

486
00:24:42,100 --> 00:24:39,520
then present those two sources and most

487
00:24:43,360 --> 00:24:42,110
journalists are not investigative

488
00:24:45,190 --> 00:24:43,370
journalists anymore they don't do point

489
00:24:47,049 --> 00:24:45,200
to point for point they do headline news

490
00:24:50,530 --> 00:24:47,059
and that's it sensationalism for clicks

491
00:24:52,240 --> 00:24:50,540
and ad revenue and that's as far as

492
00:24:55,539 --> 00:24:52,250
they'll go and when you when they do

493
00:24:58,030 --> 00:24:55,549
reach a journalist to whom is an

494
00:25:00,460 --> 00:24:58,040
investigative journalist who do has a

495
00:25:02,830 --> 00:25:00,470
firm understanding of how the government

496
00:25:04,480 --> 00:25:02,840
and the military works and you know

497
00:25:05,919 --> 00:25:04,490
understands what a FOIA request is and

498
00:25:08,140 --> 00:25:05,929
understands that when somebody presents

499
00:25:10,390 --> 00:25:08,150
information you have to verify using

500
00:25:12,100 --> 00:25:10,400
numerous sources numerous data points to

501
00:25:14,230 --> 00:25:12,110
to make sure that it's at least somewhat

502
00:25:15,549 --> 00:25:14,240
accurate and right if they reach someone

503
00:25:18,490 --> 00:25:15,559
like that and the person starts asking

504
00:25:21,010 --> 00:25:18,500
too many questions the current pattern

505
00:25:23,320 --> 00:25:21,020
is that they then break contact they

506
00:25:24,850 --> 00:25:23,330
will write them and you know you're

507
00:25:27,010 --> 00:25:24,860
talking about the journalists and the

508
00:25:29,740 --> 00:25:27,020
way they do sources you know it used to

509
00:25:31,360 --> 00:25:29,750
be it's supposed to be you go out when

510
00:25:33,760 --> 00:25:31,370
you have an allegation or something pops

511
00:25:36,700 --> 00:25:33,770
up you're supposed to go out and get two

512
00:25:38,470 --> 00:25:36,710
or three preferably three independent

513
00:25:40,509 --> 00:25:38,480
sources that you come up with on your

514
00:25:43,690 --> 00:25:40,519
own through your own investigation work

515
00:25:46,029 --> 00:25:43,700
well you know these days it's it's like

516
00:25:48,699 --> 00:25:46,039
they have somebody bring them a story

517
00:25:50,619 --> 00:25:48,709
and then they'll say what are your what

518
00:25:53,379 --> 00:25:50,629
are your sources on that and the story

519
00:25:54,940 --> 00:25:53,389
bringer says well here's my two sources

520
00:25:56,649 --> 00:25:54,950
and the journalist would use those two

521
00:25:58,599 --> 00:25:56,659
sources it's like the whistleblower

522
00:26:02,169 --> 00:25:58,609
circus okay

523
00:26:04,719 --> 00:26:02,179
those guys are notorious for oh here's

524
00:26:07,749 --> 00:26:04,729
the latest guy who was a former seal it

525
00:26:10,599 --> 00:26:07,759
really wasn't and you know done

526
00:26:12,329 --> 00:26:10,609
autopsies on 50,000 aliens bah bah bah

527
00:26:15,729 --> 00:26:12,339
bah blah and he's telling the truth

528
00:26:17,499 --> 00:26:15,739
because two of our other members of the

529
00:26:19,299 --> 00:26:17,509
whistleblower circus are backing him up

530
00:26:21,669 --> 00:26:19,309
and and you just kind of slap your

531
00:26:23,589 --> 00:26:21,679
forehead and say are you guys serious

532
00:26:25,989 --> 00:26:23,599
and yet there's a bunch of people out

533
00:26:28,989 --> 00:26:25,999
there that buy it and you you tell them

534
00:26:32,079 --> 00:26:28,999
they're they're telling you that nut

535
00:26:34,899 --> 00:26:32,089
number one is credible because nuts

536
00:26:38,069 --> 00:26:34,909
number two and three are backing him up

537
00:26:40,149 --> 00:26:38,079
and it's just it's astonishing you know

538
00:26:42,669 --> 00:26:40,159
but this seems to be the way the

539
00:26:44,169 --> 00:26:42,679
journalists were is is though they ask

540
00:26:46,269 --> 00:26:44,179
the story bringer hey you got a couple

541
00:26:49,269 --> 00:26:46,279
of sources on that yeah sure here's my

542
00:26:52,899 --> 00:26:49,279
ringers and that's what passes for

543
00:26:54,009 --> 00:26:52,909
journalism and there are individuals

544
00:26:57,339 --> 00:26:54,019
such as myself we're trying to be able

545
00:26:59,440 --> 00:26:57,349
to uncover the information behind it and

546
00:27:00,940 --> 00:26:59,450
working actively against it because you

547
00:27:02,469 --> 00:27:00,950
know the the manipulation of media

548
00:27:03,940 --> 00:27:02,479
whether it's by the government or

549
00:27:06,310 --> 00:27:03,950
whether it's by organizations who are

550
00:27:08,739 --> 00:27:06,320
trying to profit from it it's not good

551
00:27:10,449 --> 00:27:08,749
because the media is supposed to be you

552
00:27:12,069 --> 00:27:10,459
know that bastion of integrity that's

553
00:27:13,209 --> 00:27:12,079
supposed to inform the population about

554
00:27:15,399 --> 00:27:13,219
what's going on there's supposed to be

555
00:27:17,949 --> 00:27:15,409
the counterbalance to the forces that

556
00:27:21,639 --> 00:27:17,959
are in government and if that's being

557
00:27:23,109 --> 00:27:21,649
used especially to carry on a particular

558
00:27:25,419 --> 00:27:23,119
paradigm about a phenomenon though we

559
00:27:26,799 --> 00:27:25,429
may not know very much about at all if

560
00:27:30,249 --> 00:27:26,809
we're going to take a look at things

561
00:27:31,930 --> 00:27:30,259
that's bad at least in my opinion like

562
00:27:32,649 --> 00:27:31,940
just just from a guy who's who's and I'm

563
00:27:34,959 --> 00:27:32,659
in advertising

564
00:27:38,799 --> 00:27:34,969
so alright we're we're more hated than

565
00:27:40,449 --> 00:27:38,809
lawyers if that's at least in certain in

566
00:27:41,829 --> 00:27:40,459
certain circles so if I'm saying like

567
00:27:44,199 --> 00:27:41,839
that's bad for as far as integrity is

568
00:27:49,560 --> 00:27:44,209
concerned alright maybe this is

569
00:27:53,109 --> 00:27:49,570
something we need to take a look at it

570
00:27:54,290 --> 00:27:53,119
but when you do when you try to do these

571
00:27:56,750 --> 00:27:54,300
things there's

572
00:28:00,650 --> 00:27:56,760
you know you get the cacophony of all

573
00:28:01,090 --> 00:28:00,660
these different voices just coming at

574
00:28:07,820 --> 00:28:01,100
you

575
00:28:11,720 --> 00:28:07,830
mm-hmm in in things being done this way

576
00:28:13,520 --> 00:28:11,730
they want to drown you out the people

577
00:28:17,300 --> 00:28:13,530
who want to believe what's being pushed

578
00:28:22,130 --> 00:28:17,310
they want to drown you out it it's just

579
00:28:24,770 --> 00:28:22,140
really you can't you can't be that voice

580
00:28:28,070 --> 00:28:24,780
of caution it seems like for anybody

581
00:28:31,400 --> 00:28:28,080
these days they just want to you know

582
00:28:33,910 --> 00:28:31,410
leave me alone and yeah you know in life

583
00:28:39,260 --> 00:28:33,920
you want to make your own mistakes but

584
00:28:42,020 --> 00:28:39,270
you know sometimes it does pay off to

585
00:28:44,840 --> 00:28:42,030
maybe consider what that voice of

586
00:28:47,060 --> 00:28:44,850
dissent or that voice of disagreement at

587
00:28:50,750 --> 00:28:47,070
least is trying to tell you you know and

588
00:28:53,120 --> 00:28:50,760
be armed with that and you know we're in

589
00:28:55,580 --> 00:28:53,130
a time where people just want to hear

590
00:28:58,130 --> 00:28:55,590
what they want to hear and that has

591
00:29:01,190 --> 00:28:58,140
infected journalism that has infected

592
00:29:05,930 --> 00:29:01,200
what's supposed to be the objective

593
00:29:11,000 --> 00:29:05,940
source of what's going on and I don't

594
00:29:15,380 --> 00:29:11,010
know if there's any any going back for

595
00:29:19,340 --> 00:29:15,390
the purveyors of this you know that we

596
00:29:23,210 --> 00:29:19,350
know already they might be ruined it

597
00:29:26,150 --> 00:29:23,220
might require whole new sources whole

598
00:29:28,370 --> 00:29:26,160
new organizations only if they can get

599
00:29:29,930 --> 00:29:28,380
them their stuff out there or at least a

600
00:29:31,880 --> 00:29:29,940
complete change of the paradigm because

601
00:29:33,410 --> 00:29:31,890
you're you're potentially tearing down

602
00:29:37,400 --> 00:29:33,420
the way that the phenomena has been

603
00:29:39,470 --> 00:29:37,410
looked at for 30 40 years and that's

604
00:29:43,100 --> 00:29:39,480
during to some people it's like saying

605
00:29:45,710 --> 00:29:43,110
you know the emperor has no clothes well

606
00:29:49,730 --> 00:29:45,720
what I find I'm glad you mentioned you

607
00:29:53,450 --> 00:29:49,740
know the narrative of 30 40 years there

608
00:29:55,430 --> 00:29:53,460
about it I have expressed this many

609
00:29:58,250 --> 00:29:55,440
times I'm probably here and elsewhere

610
00:30:01,520 --> 00:29:58,260
that in my personal opinion I put

611
00:30:04,100 --> 00:30:01,530
numbers on it I say that about 90% of

612
00:30:07,610 --> 00:30:04,110
what people have seen and reporting is

613
00:30:08,090 --> 00:30:07,620
you know UFOs is most likely some type

614
00:30:10,610 --> 00:30:08,100
of you

615
00:30:13,520 --> 00:30:10,620
technology you know classified or

616
00:30:14,480 --> 00:30:13,530
proprietary or misunderstood to some

617
00:30:17,150 --> 00:30:14,490
degree okay

618
00:30:18,860 --> 00:30:17,160
90% folks that's where I stand on it you

619
00:30:22,220 --> 00:30:18,870
don't have to agree with me so what does

620
00:30:24,770 --> 00:30:22,230
that leave that leaves in my opinion 10%

621
00:30:28,520 --> 00:30:24,780
not explained by human technology okay

622
00:30:31,279 --> 00:30:28,530
and I absolutely am convinced that a

623
00:30:34,539 --> 00:30:31,289
percentage of that remaining 10% not all

624
00:30:38,690 --> 00:30:34,549
of that 10% but a fair portion of it is

625
00:30:42,710 --> 00:30:38,700
probably off world technology its et

626
00:30:44,230 --> 00:30:42,720
technology so to speak okay now I look

627
00:30:47,600 --> 00:30:44,240
at that I'm thinking you know what I

628
00:30:50,180 --> 00:30:47,610
despite what some guys are gonna say I

629
00:30:53,240 --> 00:30:50,190
am as reasonable as the next reasonable

630
00:30:57,260 --> 00:30:53,250
person okay and if I can see this that

631
00:31:00,560 --> 00:30:57,270
et probably only explains a small

632
00:31:03,740 --> 00:31:00,570
percentage of all UFO sightings then I

633
00:31:07,010 --> 00:31:03,750
ask you this why do we continue to let

634
00:31:09,680 --> 00:31:07,020
the et hypothesis people dominate the

635
00:31:12,230 --> 00:31:09,690
conversation the way we do I know why

636
00:31:14,180 --> 00:31:12,240
because people find it sexy right now

637
00:31:16,399 --> 00:31:14,190
we've got how many generations that grew

638
00:31:19,750 --> 00:31:16,409
up on Close Encounters an EEG thank you

639
00:31:22,039 --> 00:31:19,760
Spielberg you did your job well and

640
00:31:23,690 --> 00:31:22,049
that's what they that's what they're

641
00:31:26,210 --> 00:31:23,700
hoping they all see them they're all

642
00:31:28,399 --> 00:31:26,220
Elliot they're all right near II you

643
00:31:29,270 --> 00:31:28,409
know from Close Encounters they're all

644
00:31:32,810 --> 00:31:29,280
Mulder

645
00:31:34,430 --> 00:31:32,820
now now to be fair and again to to jest

646
00:31:35,149 --> 00:31:34,440
to at least have seemed like I don't

647
00:31:36,590 --> 00:31:35,159
think you're just you know completely

648
00:31:38,480 --> 00:31:36,600
awesome to make sure there's some

649
00:31:40,760 --> 00:31:38,490
impartiality and some current balance

650
00:31:43,159 --> 00:31:40,770
traditions going here I'll throw you a

651
00:31:45,200 --> 00:31:43,169
curveball okay what would you say to

652
00:31:47,210 --> 00:31:45,210
people who say that you having you know

653
00:31:48,080 --> 00:31:47,220
having your experience with within the

654
00:31:51,289 --> 00:31:48,090
government and within the intelligence

655
00:31:53,600 --> 00:31:51,299
community and having a you know interest

656
00:31:55,190 --> 00:31:53,610
in this that what you're saying could be

657
00:31:56,510 --> 00:31:55,200
along the same lines but a different

658
00:31:57,890 --> 00:31:56,520
flip of the coin or a different side of

659
00:32:00,710 --> 00:31:57,900
the coin where you're trying to carve

660
00:32:02,090 --> 00:32:00,720
out your own niche in terms of this you

661
00:32:03,560 --> 00:32:02,100
know this information or this phenomena

662
00:32:05,419 --> 00:32:03,570
and then write what you're saying may

663
00:32:07,190 --> 00:32:05,429
not have any validity to it based on the

664
00:32:11,390 --> 00:32:07,200
experience that they've had being lied

665
00:32:12,649 --> 00:32:11,400
to by other people right okay well and

666
00:32:14,779 --> 00:32:12,659
that's a good question

667
00:32:16,310 --> 00:32:14,789
why would anybody trust me I'm former

668
00:32:21,049 --> 00:32:16,320
OSI for crying out loud

669
00:32:21,950 --> 00:32:21,059
AAF OSI that just wow there's people

670
00:32:26,299 --> 00:32:21,960
with plenty of Ben

671
00:32:28,250 --> 00:32:26,309
for that organization you know so how do

672
00:32:31,760 --> 00:32:28,260
you know I'm not part of perception

673
00:32:35,600 --> 00:32:31,770
management right as far as I can address

674
00:32:37,760 --> 00:32:35,610
that this way you you brought up a good

675
00:32:40,490 --> 00:32:37,770
point how do you know I'm not carving a

676
00:32:44,690 --> 00:32:40,500
niche well one way is to look at my

677
00:32:47,360 --> 00:32:44,700
output my product okay I will have I

678
00:32:50,990 --> 00:32:47,370
will be releasing my tenth nonfiction

679
00:32:55,010 --> 00:32:51,000
book later this year okay

680
00:32:58,430 --> 00:32:55,020
I have out of the nine that I've

681
00:33:02,139 --> 00:32:58,440
published already three of them have to

682
00:33:06,529 --> 00:33:02,149
do with potential occult murder and

683
00:33:10,610 --> 00:33:06,539
synchronicity and weird things okay the

684
00:33:14,710 --> 00:33:10,620
other another three of them have to do

685
00:33:18,560 --> 00:33:14,720
with lost cities ancient mysteries

686
00:33:22,100 --> 00:33:18,570
historical individuals who might have

687
00:33:24,320 --> 00:33:22,110
been part of you know organizations

688
00:33:26,960 --> 00:33:24,330
looking for lost relics okay so there

689
00:33:28,659 --> 00:33:26,970
are six books not about UFOs my first

690
00:33:31,669 --> 00:33:28,669
non-fiction book is about Disneyland

691
00:33:35,810 --> 00:33:31,679
okay so there's seven books right there

692
00:33:38,419 --> 00:33:35,820
and then there's the remaining two now

693
00:33:41,110 --> 00:33:38,429
one of those is about breakaway

694
00:33:44,570 --> 00:33:41,120
civilizations okay and talks about

695
00:33:49,130 --> 00:33:44,580
secret space program related stuff so

696
00:33:51,049 --> 00:33:49,140
it's kind of a UFO book and then the

697
00:33:54,649 --> 00:33:51,059
only one that you could say is really

698
00:33:56,269 --> 00:33:54,659
the classic UFO book is my book

699
00:33:59,029 --> 00:33:56,279
shimmering light and I wrote that

700
00:34:00,919 --> 00:33:59,039
because my dad it's my dad's personal

701
00:34:04,700 --> 00:34:00,929
story and I finally had to dig in and

702
00:34:06,500 --> 00:34:04,710
analyze that so my point is Oh in the

703
00:34:08,359 --> 00:34:06,510
new book is another one about the

704
00:34:13,220 --> 00:34:08,369
historical figure looking for lost

705
00:34:18,980 --> 00:34:13,230
relics okay so one book out of ten since

706
00:34:21,560 --> 00:34:18,990
2008 is about UFOs and such I would say

707
00:34:25,490 --> 00:34:21,570
the reason I went through all this for

708
00:34:29,329 --> 00:34:25,500
those not familiar with my work is you

709
00:34:32,839 --> 00:34:29,339
know in ten years ten books and only one

710
00:34:34,460 --> 00:34:32,849
of them is about UFOs directly so if I

711
00:34:36,470 --> 00:34:34,470
were trying to carve a niche to answer

712
00:34:39,829 --> 00:34:36,480
your very good

713
00:34:42,109 --> 00:34:39,839
doesn't it seem like I have half or more

714
00:34:44,149 --> 00:34:42,119
of those books about UFOs and Here I am

715
00:34:46,909 --> 00:34:44,159
trying to push my narrative on it

716
00:34:50,540 --> 00:34:46,919
through those books no by my product no

717
00:34:53,599 --> 00:34:50,550
I when I talk about this it does not

718
00:34:56,569 --> 00:34:53,609
push my products it you know maybe one

719
00:34:59,690 --> 00:34:56,579
or two books touch on this stuff so that

720
00:35:01,760 --> 00:34:59,700
I think is a good answer to your very

721
00:35:06,109 --> 00:35:01,770
good question

722
00:35:08,510 --> 00:35:06,119
but also I would say listen to what I'm

723
00:35:12,950 --> 00:35:08,520
saying follow up on what I'm saying

724
00:35:15,380 --> 00:35:12,960
honestly okay don't go to don't stack

725
00:35:17,390 --> 00:35:15,390
your own deck where you disagree with

726
00:35:19,550 --> 00:35:17,400
something I say and then I'm not talking

727
00:35:22,310 --> 00:35:19,560
about you I'm speaking generically here

728
00:35:24,109 --> 00:35:22,320
rhetorically you know person should not

729
00:35:25,460 --> 00:35:24,119
just go out and find sources that are

730
00:35:28,099 --> 00:35:25,470
going to agree with them to come back

731
00:35:30,170 --> 00:35:28,109
and say aha see they said you were wrong

732
00:35:32,270 --> 00:35:30,180
that's the same as the whistle blower

733
00:35:36,859 --> 00:35:32,280
circus using nuts number two and three

734
00:35:37,490 --> 00:35:36,869
to back up not number one but it's a

735
00:35:39,609 --> 00:35:37,500
good question

736
00:35:42,620 --> 00:35:39,619
you're right why should people trust me

737
00:35:47,030 --> 00:35:42,630
that that takes time

738
00:35:48,770 --> 00:35:47,040
i s you don't see me going out there

739
00:35:53,870 --> 00:35:48,780
saying this will happen that will happen

740
00:35:55,910 --> 00:35:53,880
right or I've got a secret that you know

741
00:36:00,859 --> 00:35:55,920
I'm gonna build up your excitement about

742
00:36:03,829 --> 00:36:00,869
and then never deliver on that so I

743
00:36:06,140 --> 00:36:03,839
don't know I think it's just the way I

744
00:36:09,530 --> 00:36:06,150
do what I do that I think would answer

745
00:36:11,450 --> 00:36:09,540
your question and with this soda to try

746
00:36:15,890 --> 00:36:11,460
and tie up this theme of something big

747
00:36:19,099 --> 00:36:15,900
is coming and huge gonna be huge I'm

748
00:36:21,530 --> 00:36:19,109
telling you right now you have something

749
00:36:23,420 --> 00:36:21,540
very big coming up which you've been

750
00:36:26,420 --> 00:36:23,430
working on and I know I follow your

751
00:36:28,520 --> 00:36:26,430
social media accounts and I always love

752
00:36:30,920 --> 00:36:28,530
the you know little tidbits of

753
00:36:33,410 --> 00:36:30,930
information and you have one of your

754
00:36:36,500 --> 00:36:33,420
works being turned into a television

755
00:36:38,890 --> 00:36:36,510
show potentially attentionally it's in

756
00:36:42,859 --> 00:36:38,900
it's in what they call development the

757
00:36:45,050 --> 00:36:42,869
producer yes a producer has purchased

758
00:36:49,340 --> 00:36:45,060
the rights that the television film

759
00:36:53,330 --> 00:36:49,350
serial rights to my empire of the wheel

760
00:36:58,820 --> 00:36:53,340
trilogy and it is presently being

761
00:37:01,250 --> 00:36:58,830
developed as a TV series they are

762
00:37:03,770 --> 00:37:01,260
working on the series you know they're

763
00:37:05,990 --> 00:37:03,780
hammering out the series Bible and the

764
00:37:08,900 --> 00:37:06,000
there right now working on the script

765
00:37:10,300 --> 00:37:08,910
for the pilot episode Wow and I'm very

766
00:37:13,280 --> 00:37:10,310
excited about this

767
00:37:14,450 --> 00:37:13,290
now Empire the wheel I don't think we

768
00:37:16,820 --> 00:37:14,460
discussed that the last time that you

769
00:37:20,150 --> 00:37:16,830
were on in great depth and you know

770
00:37:23,570 --> 00:37:20,160
having no time to well do much of

771
00:37:25,580 --> 00:37:23,580
anything hardly you know you're a dad

772
00:37:28,730 --> 00:37:25,590
I'm a dad we rely it we realized that

773
00:37:33,530 --> 00:37:28,740
there is not much time to spend on other

774
00:37:37,130 --> 00:37:33,540
pursuits such as yours yours is younger

775
00:37:38,420 --> 00:37:37,140
than mine oh yes busier than I am so I

776
00:37:40,280 --> 00:37:38,430
wanted to be able to at least get an

777
00:37:42,470 --> 00:37:40,290
idea of the work and how it was

778
00:37:46,220 --> 00:37:42,480
developed because I honestly think that

779
00:37:47,810 --> 00:37:46,230
you know if it's good enough to have it

780
00:37:49,280 --> 00:37:47,820
optioned that people should learn about

781
00:37:50,840 --> 00:37:49,290
it so that they can go pick it up and

782
00:37:52,550 --> 00:37:50,850
read it themselves and they don't think

783
00:37:56,510 --> 00:37:52,560
wait for the series and then you know

784
00:37:57,950 --> 00:37:56,520
waits for a wheel bowl if they're a fan

785
00:38:00,020 --> 00:37:57,960
of Game of Thrones and they want to see

786
00:38:04,280 --> 00:38:00,030
two characters kind of go at how this

787
00:38:07,730 --> 00:38:04,290
happen is such a deep story that it

788
00:38:12,630 --> 00:38:07,740
could take hours or days to explain it

789
00:38:20,930 --> 00:38:17,279
this was something that certain aspects

790
00:38:23,370 --> 00:38:20,940
really I certain aspects I stumbled upon

791
00:38:26,190 --> 00:38:23,380
as you can tell I'm stammering cuz it's

792
00:38:29,940 --> 00:38:26,200
where to begin but I'll begin with I had

793
00:38:32,490 --> 00:38:29,950
written the Disneyland book and I was

794
00:38:36,799 --> 00:38:32,500
doing some follow up on some concepts in

795
00:38:38,930 --> 00:38:36,809
that book and that led me to looking for

796
00:38:40,680 --> 00:38:38,940
paranormal reports of paranormal

797
00:38:42,779 --> 00:38:40,690
activity

798
00:38:45,630 --> 00:38:42,789
you know ghost stories what-have-you

799
00:38:48,059 --> 00:38:45,640
here in the San Bernardino Valley in

800
00:38:52,279 --> 00:38:48,069
California which is a big part of the

801
00:38:56,480 --> 00:38:52,289
what they call the Inland Empire and I

802
00:38:59,640 --> 00:38:56,490
came across a ghost story

803
00:39:03,799 --> 00:38:59,650
which was posted online by a local

804
00:39:07,170 --> 00:39:03,809
librarian a lady named Ann Walker and I

805
00:39:09,329 --> 00:39:07,180
contacted her I met with her and she

806
00:39:14,250 --> 00:39:09,339
told me the story it had to do with a

807
00:39:18,059 --> 00:39:14,260
shopping mall being haunted and she told

808
00:39:19,680 --> 00:39:18,069
me about this woman who she was

809
00:39:21,630 --> 00:39:19,690
convinced had been murdered and it was

810
00:39:24,329 --> 00:39:21,640
made to look like a suicide or was

811
00:39:26,490 --> 00:39:24,339
called labeled a suicide and she told me

812
00:39:29,819 --> 00:39:26,500
go look at the news reports it happened

813
00:39:32,759 --> 00:39:29,829
in 1915 and you'll see what I mean

814
00:39:35,190 --> 00:39:32,769
so I did just that I went to the Special

815
00:39:37,829 --> 00:39:35,200
Collections room library downtown San

816
00:39:42,870 --> 00:39:37,839
Bernardino and I found the reports on

817
00:39:45,900 --> 00:39:42,880
the very strange odd circumstances of

818
00:39:47,519 --> 00:39:45,910
this woman's death but being you know a

819
00:39:51,890 --> 00:39:47,529
criminal investigator a professional

820
00:39:55,470 --> 00:39:51,900
investigator I expanded the scope of

821
00:39:59,940 --> 00:39:55,480
this research and I found in the

822
00:40:03,150 --> 00:39:59,950
newspapers that in a period of in some

823
00:40:05,609 --> 00:40:03,160
cases days apart but for the most part

824
00:40:08,400 --> 00:40:05,619
just weeks apart that there were in one

825
00:40:12,269 --> 00:40:08,410
case it was a couple of months but there

826
00:40:16,490 --> 00:40:12,279
were a total of seven very odd and

827
00:40:21,329 --> 00:40:16,500
questionable deaths that went on in late

828
00:40:25,850 --> 00:40:21,339
1915 and the more I looked the more I

829
00:40:28,760 --> 00:40:25,860
saw the the fingerprints of a cult

830
00:40:30,530 --> 00:40:28,770
seems going on here and the more I

831
00:40:32,270 --> 00:40:30,540
looked at the people who were present in

832
00:40:36,980 --> 00:40:32,280
the area

833
00:40:41,210 --> 00:40:36,990
I found red flags true red flags one of

834
00:40:43,430 --> 00:40:41,220
which being that the first spiritualist

835
00:40:47,230 --> 00:40:43,440
temple for those who don't know in the

836
00:40:50,270 --> 00:40:47,240
19 men - late 19th century spiritualism

837
00:40:55,280 --> 00:40:50,280
became very popular in the United States

838
00:40:57,260 --> 00:40:55,290
and spiritualism is what falls within

839
00:40:58,040 --> 00:40:57,270
the category what we call New Age today

840
00:41:01,760 --> 00:40:58,050
ok

841
00:41:03,860 --> 00:41:01,770
doing seances having ghosts come and you

842
00:41:06,800 --> 00:41:03,870
know tell you about grandma and all that

843
00:41:08,570 --> 00:41:06,810
stuff it was very popular but you know

844
00:41:11,180 --> 00:41:08,580
it was taken very seriously by a lot of

845
00:41:13,160 --> 00:41:11,190
people and the first spiritualist temple

846
00:41:17,210 --> 00:41:13,170
in the state of California was right

847
00:41:21,110 --> 00:41:17,220
here in San Bernardino and it was full

848
00:41:23,810 --> 00:41:21,120
of prominent local folks and it was in

849
00:41:27,230 --> 00:41:23,820
existence at the time of these very

850
00:41:32,080 --> 00:41:27,240
strange deaths well that alone was

851
00:41:36,290 --> 00:41:32,090
interesting but when I looked at the

852
00:41:39,290 --> 00:41:36,300
little occultic clues and details

853
00:41:44,420 --> 00:41:39,300
surrounding these deaths and I had

854
00:41:46,640 --> 00:41:44,430
spiritualist there and I discovered the

855
00:41:49,040 --> 00:41:46,650
presence and involvement of some of the

856
00:41:52,670 --> 00:41:49,050
events in the aftermath of these deaths

857
00:41:55,520 --> 00:41:52,680
in this mystery of a man named Walter

858
00:41:57,380 --> 00:41:55,530
Franklin Prince I got goose bumps now

859
00:42:00,490 --> 00:41:57,390
most people say well who the heck is

860
00:42:02,690 --> 00:42:00,500
that well I'll tell you who that is a

861
00:42:06,110 --> 00:42:02,700
decade after the events here in San

862
00:42:08,060 --> 00:42:06,120
Bernardino in the 1920s we had Harry

863
00:42:12,020 --> 00:42:08,070
Houdini the famous escape artist and

864
00:42:16,490 --> 00:42:12,030
stage magic performer very famously go

865
00:42:19,760 --> 00:42:16,500
after corrupt fraudulent spiritualist

866
00:42:21,710 --> 00:42:19,770
mediums okay now there's a couple of

867
00:42:24,770 --> 00:42:21,720
guys calles and Sloman who have written

868
00:42:26,900 --> 00:42:24,780
a very good book and others have talked

869
00:42:28,670 --> 00:42:26,910
about this and and I'm convinced as an

870
00:42:30,260 --> 00:42:28,680
investigator and researcher I'm

871
00:42:33,130 --> 00:42:30,270
convinced but callous and Sloman wrote a

872
00:42:35,510 --> 00:42:33,140
book about the murder of Harry Houdini

873
00:42:37,820 --> 00:42:35,520
they talked about how he had been an

874
00:42:39,770 --> 00:42:37,830
undercover operative for the u.s. Secret

875
00:42:42,200 --> 00:42:39,780
Service had worked on some stuff

876
00:42:45,559 --> 00:42:42,210
on the half of request of Scotland Yard

877
00:42:47,599 --> 00:42:45,569
and Houdini was investigating these

878
00:42:52,359 --> 00:42:47,609
corrupt spiritualist mediums in the

879
00:42:55,670 --> 00:42:52,369
1920s okay his partner in doing this was

880
00:42:58,520 --> 00:42:55,680
Walter Franklin Prince the man who was

881
00:43:00,109 --> 00:42:58,530
here in San Bernadino during the occult

882
00:43:02,859 --> 00:43:00,119
mystery that I've investigated and

883
00:43:05,660 --> 00:43:02,869
written about he was an Episcopal

884
00:43:09,650 --> 00:43:05,670
minister they pissed at the Episcopal

885
00:43:12,859 --> 00:43:09,660
Church here and he very publicly gave

886
00:43:15,890 --> 00:43:12,869
this woman this mystery woman who was

887
00:43:18,800 --> 00:43:15,900
labeled a suicide very publicly he gave

888
00:43:22,069 --> 00:43:18,810
her a very public official Church

889
00:43:26,120 --> 00:43:22,079
funeral well back in 1915 folks you

890
00:43:29,270 --> 00:43:26,130
didn't do that okay not for a suicide my

891
00:43:30,380 --> 00:43:29,280
book goes into all the details why I'm

892
00:43:32,900 --> 00:43:30,390
convinced

893
00:43:35,839 --> 00:43:32,910
Walter Franklin Prince knew who this

894
00:43:39,170 --> 00:43:35,849
woman really was what she really was and

895
00:43:41,240 --> 00:43:39,180
that explains why he gave her this

896
00:43:42,740 --> 00:43:41,250
public funeral being an alleged suicide

897
00:43:44,839 --> 00:43:42,750
I think he didn't believe she was a

898
00:43:50,450 --> 00:43:44,849
suicide at all and here's what's

899
00:43:53,870 --> 00:43:50,460
important within days of giving this

900
00:43:56,150 --> 00:43:53,880
woman this funeral Prince and his wife

901
00:43:58,520 --> 00:43:56,160
pack up their belongings he leaves the

902
00:44:00,980 --> 00:43:58,530
church he leaves San Bernardino before

903
00:44:04,309 --> 00:44:00,990
the month is out and goes back to Boston

904
00:44:06,280 --> 00:44:04,319
to become the assistant director of the

905
00:44:10,550 --> 00:44:06,290
American psychical Research Association

906
00:44:12,530 --> 00:44:10,560
okay for which he would be the director

907
00:44:14,569 --> 00:44:12,540
in the 1920s when he worked with Houdini

908
00:44:17,059 --> 00:44:14,579
going after the spiritualist what am I

909
00:44:19,069 --> 00:44:17,069
saying what that implied to me which I

910
00:44:23,240 --> 00:44:19,079
had to find evidence of and I had to dig

911
00:44:25,160 --> 00:44:23,250
into was I think Prince knew something

912
00:44:28,579 --> 00:44:25,170
about spiritualist involvement with

913
00:44:31,700 --> 00:44:28,589
these deaths and that gave him the bad

914
00:44:34,430 --> 00:44:31,710
taste for spiritualists and what was

915
00:44:36,620 --> 00:44:34,440
what was really going on with some of

916
00:44:38,599 --> 00:44:36,630
them while he was here in San Bernardino

917
00:44:40,760 --> 00:44:38,609
and I think what happened in San

918
00:44:42,620 --> 00:44:40,770
Bernardino fueled his fire to team up

919
00:44:45,140 --> 00:44:42,630
with Houdini and go after these people

920
00:44:47,300 --> 00:44:45,150
in the following decade now that right

921
00:44:49,640 --> 00:44:47,310
there all of that is just one little

922
00:44:52,609 --> 00:44:49,650
slice of this whole empire the wheel

923
00:44:53,550 --> 00:44:52,619
mystery but that's a taste of the kinds

924
00:44:56,790 --> 00:44:53,560
of things

925
00:44:57,900 --> 00:44:56,800
that I was uncovering now for Harry

926
00:45:00,030 --> 00:44:57,910
Houdini I didn't know that he had

927
00:45:03,180 --> 00:45:00,040
actually gone after the the spiritualist

928
00:45:04,410 --> 00:45:03,190
what was the main because this sounds

929
00:45:05,490 --> 00:45:04,420
very parallel to what we talked she

930
00:45:08,040 --> 00:45:05,500
talked about at the beginning of the

931
00:45:09,960 --> 00:45:08,050
show well but what was the reason behind

932
00:45:13,080 --> 00:45:09,970
him going after them in the first place

933
00:45:16,290 --> 00:45:13,090
oh they were doing things like you know

934
00:45:18,570 --> 00:45:16,300
doing fake seances you know taking

935
00:45:21,120 --> 00:45:18,580
people's money this was a this was a

936
00:45:25,460 --> 00:45:21,130
major racket for these folks okay they

937
00:45:28,680 --> 00:45:25,470
were they were making some Bank they had

938
00:45:29,970 --> 00:45:28,690
you know they had famous clients that

939
00:45:31,950 --> 00:45:29,980
were you know either

940
00:45:34,980 --> 00:45:31,960
celebrities one way or another but they

941
00:45:38,460 --> 00:45:34,990
had politicians in some cases and there

942
00:45:41,310 --> 00:45:38,470
was even a connection to the one of the

943
00:45:45,090 --> 00:45:41,320
presidents at the time so these are

944
00:45:48,000 --> 00:45:45,100
people that were you know being like the

945
00:45:50,010 --> 00:45:48,010
almost like the the sideshow gypsy

946
00:45:53,850 --> 00:45:50,020
fortune teller okay

947
00:45:54,600 --> 00:45:53,860
faking Houdini in his agents caught in

948
00:45:57,810 --> 00:45:54,610
the act

949
00:46:02,820 --> 00:45:57,820
several of these spiritual spiritualist

950
00:46:05,370 --> 00:46:02,830
mediums faking séances in apparitions

951
00:46:06,180 --> 00:46:05,380
and ghostly voices he would catch them

952
00:46:07,890 --> 00:46:06,190
in the act

953
00:46:11,670 --> 00:46:07,900
turn the lights on in some cases and

954
00:46:13,560 --> 00:46:11,680
expose them okay so they were hating

955
00:46:16,170 --> 00:46:13,570
Houdini because he was messing with

956
00:46:20,880 --> 00:46:16,180
their their racket their livelihood in

957
00:46:22,950 --> 00:46:20,890
this it was interesting he spoke before

958
00:46:24,960 --> 00:46:22,960
Congress he testified before Congress on

959
00:46:28,800 --> 00:46:24,970
this this actually came before Congress

960
00:46:31,410 --> 00:46:28,810
in 1926 summer 1926 and one of the most

961
00:46:33,330 --> 00:46:31,420
successful mediums at the time outside

962
00:46:36,480 --> 00:46:33,340
of congressional chamber was out in the

963
00:46:39,000 --> 00:46:36,490
hall where other people heard this she

964
00:46:41,580 --> 00:46:39,010
walked up a Houdini and said come

965
00:46:44,490 --> 00:46:41,590
November you won't be here you won't be

966
00:46:49,350 --> 00:46:44,500
a problem Harry Houdini died just days

967
00:46:53,300 --> 00:46:49,360
before Halloween that year oh yeah he

968
00:46:56,850 --> 00:46:53,310
was almost like it was internal injuries

969
00:46:59,310 --> 00:46:56,860
right after taking a punch from a punch

970
00:47:01,050 --> 00:46:59,320
test is that correct yeah he would he

971
00:47:03,540 --> 00:47:01,060
would take punches just to show how

972
00:47:07,440 --> 00:47:03,550
physically fit he was he was known for

973
00:47:10,680 --> 00:47:07,450
this what calluses Lomond have uncovered

974
00:47:14,120 --> 00:47:10,690
is that he and his wife his wife got the

975
00:47:22,470 --> 00:47:14,130
worst of it were hit with food poisoning

976
00:47:24,810 --> 00:47:22,480
after eating a meal at home uh and uh it

977
00:47:28,250 --> 00:47:24,820
happened also eating a meal outside the

978
00:47:31,460 --> 00:47:28,260
home so the

979
00:47:32,450 --> 00:47:31,470
the story suggests the evidence that you

980
00:47:34,370 --> 00:47:32,460
know they were able to pull together

981
00:47:37,960 --> 00:47:34,380
suggests is that somebody had been

982
00:47:42,650 --> 00:47:37,970
poisoning them and there had been a

983
00:47:45,740 --> 00:47:42,660
change in their domestic help at home

984
00:47:50,000 --> 00:47:45,750
where it's possible someone working for

985
00:47:51,740 --> 00:47:50,010
them had been poisoning the food it's

986
00:47:54,620 --> 00:47:51,750
really it's very interesting when you

987
00:47:57,050 --> 00:47:54,630
look at the details it looks like he had

988
00:48:00,650 --> 00:47:57,060
been poisoned for quite a while so that

989
00:48:03,920 --> 00:48:00,660
by the time the guy who gave him the

990
00:48:06,050 --> 00:48:03,930
fatal blows did that it ruptured I

991
00:48:09,410 --> 00:48:06,060
believe what it was is it was his spleen

992
00:48:12,380 --> 00:48:09,420
or his appendix that when he went under

993
00:48:15,530 --> 00:48:12,390
the knife when he was hospitalized for

994
00:48:18,680 --> 00:48:15,540
the issue that killed him that it said

995
00:48:21,319 --> 00:48:18,690
even in the report that as soon as the

996
00:48:23,569 --> 00:48:21,329
the doctor the surgeon cut into him the

997
00:48:27,920 --> 00:48:23,579
poison from whatever it was I think it

998
00:48:31,160 --> 00:48:27,930
was the spleen just gushed out in other

999
00:48:33,319 --> 00:48:31,170
words it was so filled with poison and

1000
00:48:35,630 --> 00:48:33,329
so infected and he he had not realized

1001
00:48:38,660 --> 00:48:35,640
that that really what it was was the

1002
00:48:43,190 --> 00:48:38,670
blows ruptured all that and that's what

1003
00:48:45,710 --> 00:48:43,200
caused the death and they knew that's

1004
00:48:50,210 --> 00:48:45,720
the implication is that the is that they

1005
00:48:52,700 --> 00:48:50,220
knew that this would likely cause the

1006
00:48:54,650 --> 00:48:52,710
death you know I'm reading just his

1007
00:48:56,809 --> 00:48:54,660
Wikipedia article here to try and make

1008
00:48:58,160 --> 00:48:56,819
sure that I can I'm looking at this and

1009
00:48:59,540 --> 00:48:58,170
it's like it's not entirely clear what

1010
00:49:01,339 --> 00:48:59,550
relationship the encounter the dressing

1011
00:49:03,680 --> 00:49:01,349
room had on Houdini's eventual death as

1012
00:49:05,750 --> 00:49:03,690
a relationship between blunt trauma and

1013
00:49:07,040 --> 00:49:05,760
appendicitis is uncertain one theory

1014
00:49:08,870 --> 00:49:07,050
suggests that Houdini was unaware that

1015
00:49:10,520 --> 00:49:08,880
he was suffering from appendicitis which

1016
00:49:13,640 --> 00:49:10,530
would have been clear to him had he not

1017
00:49:16,309 --> 00:49:13,650
received blows to the abdomen so it's

1018
00:49:17,750 --> 00:49:16,319
like did did they know that he would

1019
00:49:19,099 --> 00:49:17,760
take that type of hit or that that was

1020
00:49:22,170 --> 00:49:19,109
coming or did they just hope that he

1021
00:49:27,269 --> 00:49:24,690
like dead you know Franco said he would

1022
00:49:29,670 --> 00:49:27,279
do this as part of a kind of publicity

1023
00:49:32,220 --> 00:49:29,680
to show what you know what great

1024
00:49:34,260 --> 00:49:32,230
physical shape he was in he was known to

1025
00:49:37,049 --> 00:49:34,270
do this he would he would publicly take

1026
00:49:38,970 --> 00:49:37,059
blows to the stomach to the midriff

1027
00:49:41,579 --> 00:49:38,980
because look what great shape I'm in I

1028
00:49:44,190 --> 00:49:41,589
can take this so here's the thing they

1029
00:49:46,109 --> 00:49:44,200
know he's willing to that he does this

1030
00:49:48,150 --> 00:49:46,119
right let's say you want to kill him

1031
00:49:49,620 --> 00:49:48,160
well how could we get to him and make it

1032
00:49:52,980 --> 00:49:49,630
look like an accident or not make it

1033
00:49:55,920 --> 00:49:52,990
look like murder right well he does this

1034
00:49:59,460 --> 00:49:55,930
dumb thing where he takes blows to his

1035
00:50:01,980 --> 00:49:59,470
stomach we could if we could get poison

1036
00:50:05,099 --> 00:50:01,990
in him and you know over a period of

1037
00:50:08,549 --> 00:50:05,109
time eventually when he takes these

1038
00:50:10,829 --> 00:50:08,559
blows you know we got a good chance of

1039
00:50:12,660 --> 00:50:10,839
killing him and no one would ever guess

1040
00:50:18,390 --> 00:50:12,670
it was murder

1041
00:50:20,700 --> 00:50:18,400
so you know that's the theory people say

1042
00:50:23,010 --> 00:50:20,710
all well that's convoluted and crazy

1043
00:50:26,130 --> 00:50:23,020
such as but well you know how hard would

1044
00:50:28,440 --> 00:50:26,140
it be to poison somebody's food over to

1045
00:50:31,019 --> 00:50:28,450
extend a period of time you you get to

1046
00:50:33,569 --> 00:50:31,029
one of their employees right what about

1047
00:50:36,299 --> 00:50:33,579
the person who actually drew the blows

1048
00:50:37,170 --> 00:50:36,309
because according to two accounts that

1049
00:50:38,789 --> 00:50:37,180
are the right head

1050
00:50:40,470 --> 00:50:38,799
well Perrault Freud had to you know

1051
00:50:42,329 --> 00:50:40,480
you've got Jack Price and Sam smiley as

1052
00:50:45,660 --> 00:50:42,339
they were called gave the account that

1053
00:50:47,279 --> 00:50:45,670
this Whitehead individual just asked him

1054
00:50:48,420 --> 00:50:47,289
if he you know believed in miracles the

1055
00:50:49,260 --> 00:50:48,430
Bible and they just started hammering

1056
00:50:53,099 --> 00:50:49,270
him in the stomach

1057
00:50:55,849 --> 00:50:53,109
yeah we're does he fit into this I write

1058
00:51:02,069 --> 00:50:55,859
about that in and part of the wheel

1059
00:51:06,269 --> 00:51:02,079
three I go into Whitehead Whitehead is a

1060
00:51:10,079 --> 00:51:06,279
very shadowy character himself he when

1061
00:51:13,769 --> 00:51:10,089
he died he was living like a hermit he

1062
00:51:17,640 --> 00:51:13,779
had pretty much just disappeared off the

1063
00:51:22,549 --> 00:51:17,650
radar after the incident with Houdini

1064
00:51:27,019 --> 00:51:22,559
there I uncovered some very uncanny

1065
00:51:29,250 --> 00:51:27,029
association with an author of a cult

1066
00:51:35,610 --> 00:51:29,260
detective thrillers a guy named

1067
00:51:38,370 --> 00:51:35,620
Whitehead who himself might have some

1068
00:51:39,900 --> 00:51:38,380
type of secret society associate might

1069
00:51:42,780 --> 00:51:39,910
have had some type of secret society

1070
00:51:45,450 --> 00:51:42,790
associations and he was a virtual double

1071
00:51:47,460 --> 00:51:45,460
for the Whitehead who punched Houdini

1072
00:51:52,430 --> 00:51:47,470
and like I said I grew into the details

1073
00:51:55,770 --> 00:51:52,440
and then and Empire of the wheel 3 but

1074
00:51:58,470 --> 00:51:55,780
basically the premise is the Whitehead

1075
00:52:00,240 --> 00:51:58,480
his known contacts and he's you know

1076
00:52:02,340 --> 00:52:00,250
what we know about him and what we know

1077
00:52:06,120 --> 00:52:02,350
about his virtual double this author

1078
00:52:09,150 --> 00:52:06,130
named Whitehead between the two of them

1079
00:52:11,160 --> 00:52:09,160
they had plenty of contacts that could

1080
00:52:14,040 --> 00:52:11,170
have put them within the circles of the

1081
00:52:16,650 --> 00:52:14,050
spiritualist mediums who had an issue

1082
00:52:18,690 --> 00:52:16,660
with Houdini and if I'm not mistaken he

1083
00:52:21,960 --> 00:52:18,700
was actually a Montreal McGill

1084
00:52:23,340 --> 00:52:21,970
University student yes at the time so

1085
00:52:25,590 --> 00:52:23,350
you know and this happened in Detroit

1086
00:52:28,860 --> 00:52:25,600
what is there any information about what

1087
00:52:32,250 --> 00:52:28,870
he was doing in Detroit at the time um

1088
00:52:34,050 --> 00:52:32,260
oh gosh I would have to it's been a few

1089
00:52:36,420 --> 00:52:34,060
years since I as far as why he was in

1090
00:52:40,230 --> 00:52:36,430
Detroit you know I argue that he was

1091
00:52:43,500 --> 00:52:40,240
there to do what he did to me so you

1092
00:52:45,230 --> 00:52:43,510
know whatever business he would say he

1093
00:52:52,170 --> 00:52:45,240
was there for you know drummed up

1094
00:52:58,290 --> 00:52:52,180
remember I think he was he was punched

1095
00:53:02,450 --> 00:52:58,300
in one place and died in another and the

1096
00:53:04,890 --> 00:53:02,460
what's interesting is the issue with

1097
00:53:07,410 --> 00:53:04,900
Montreal the Montreal connection to this

1098
00:53:09,840 --> 00:53:07,420
and the theater in which it happened I

1099
00:53:11,460 --> 00:53:09,850
think was on that there's a Saint

1100
00:53:13,560 --> 00:53:11,470
Catharine in the mix I think it was on a

1101
00:53:15,270 --> 00:53:13,570
st. Catherine Street or something well

1102
00:53:17,520 --> 00:53:15,280
it you know in Empire the will one

1103
00:53:20,070 --> 00:53:17,530
Rick's Benson on my co-author on that

1104
00:53:22,170 --> 00:53:20,080
first book we point out in one

1105
00:53:24,030 --> 00:53:22,180
particular chapter that it sank this

1106
00:53:26,670 --> 00:53:24,040
particular st. Catherine st. Catherine

1107
00:53:28,590 --> 00:53:26,680
of the wheel is Hecate there was no such

1108
00:53:30,810 --> 00:53:28,600
thing as they st. Catherine she's a

1109
00:53:35,190 --> 00:53:30,820
complete fabrication by the Catholic

1110
00:53:37,410 --> 00:53:35,200
Church to synchronize Hecate worship

1111
00:53:39,480 --> 00:53:37,420
into a saint okay

1112
00:53:41,490 --> 00:53:39,490
and they've pretty much admitted if you

1113
00:53:44,640 --> 00:53:41,500
go to the I think it's the new Catholic

1114
00:53:47,010 --> 00:53:44,650
Bible and other Catholic sources Church

1115
00:53:49,080 --> 00:53:47,020
sources they say that yeah there never

1116
00:53:49,640 --> 00:53:49,090
really was a st. Catherine they took the

1117
00:53:54,319 --> 00:53:49,650
bio

1118
00:53:56,390 --> 00:53:54,329
fee of Hypatia of Alexandria and they

1119
00:54:00,200 --> 00:53:56,400
doctored it up they you know to Catholic

1120
00:54:03,650 --> 00:54:00,210
it up so to speak and they took Hypatia

1121
00:54:05,870 --> 00:54:03,660
of Alexandria and they took Hecate the

1122
00:54:07,430 --> 00:54:05,880
goddess Hecate or symbolism and such and

1123
00:54:10,160 --> 00:54:07,440
they married them together

1124
00:54:15,650 --> 00:54:10,170
it's called synchronizing or syncretized

1125
00:54:17,930 --> 00:54:15,660
a shin to create a fake identity so you

1126
00:54:20,749 --> 00:54:17,940
know that's a saint well it's that way

1127
00:54:22,759 --> 00:54:20,759
you know you don't a lien eight the

1128
00:54:24,680 --> 00:54:22,769
natives that you've conquered and I

1129
00:54:27,980 --> 00:54:24,690
think well there are very similar

1130
00:54:30,380 --> 00:54:27,990
reports to how Constantine the Great's

1131
00:54:32,950 --> 00:54:30,390
essentially co-opted Mithras ISM as well

1132
00:54:36,190 --> 00:54:32,960
as various aspects of Greek mythology

1133
00:54:39,130 --> 00:54:36,200
you know some Sumerian through in some

1134
00:54:42,970 --> 00:54:39,140
Egyptian gods for good measure and then

1135
00:54:45,880 --> 00:54:42,980
that was the part of the standardization

1136
00:54:48,739 --> 00:54:45,890
within the church to create the the full

1137
00:54:51,140 --> 00:54:48,749
right you know Orthodox doctrine from

1138
00:54:54,620 --> 00:54:51,150
that from that time so it's you know

1139
00:54:56,809 --> 00:54:54,630
Joseph Ferrell I think is the one it is

1140
00:55:00,739 --> 00:54:56,819
just a Pharaoh I can't remember which

1141
00:55:03,920 --> 00:55:00,749
hope he said he quoted but he's quoted

1142
00:55:08,329 --> 00:55:03,930
you know to me and others one of the

1143
00:55:09,859 --> 00:55:08,339
Pope's has you know said in the recent

1144
00:55:12,259 --> 00:55:09,869
history past maybe a hundred years ago

1145
00:55:15,410 --> 00:55:12,269
whatever it was couple of centuries said

1146
00:55:19,249 --> 00:55:15,420
it has served us well this myth of

1147
00:55:22,849 --> 00:55:19,259
Christ think about that that's a pope

1148
00:55:25,099 --> 00:55:22,859
you know saying that and I mean this is

1149
00:55:28,370 --> 00:55:25,109
the same organization that finally I

1150
00:55:30,470 --> 00:55:28,380
think in our times you know I think in

1151
00:55:33,440 --> 00:55:30,480
the last ten years or something maybe

1152
00:55:35,720 --> 00:55:33,450
twenty years they admitted that they

1153
00:55:38,329 --> 00:55:35,730
made up the story about Mary Magdalene

1154
00:55:40,279 --> 00:55:38,339
being a prostitute and that was to you

1155
00:55:42,170 --> 00:55:40,289
know denigrate the the image of her with

1156
00:55:44,420 --> 00:55:42,180
an you know what within the doctrine

1157
00:55:46,309 --> 00:55:44,430
going forward exactly exactly you know

1158
00:55:48,259 --> 00:55:46,319
dating back to you know Peter that

1159
00:55:51,200 --> 00:55:48,269
famous misogynist you know it just

1160
00:55:53,599 --> 00:55:51,210
cranked him up that you know when Christ

1161
00:55:55,249 --> 00:55:53,609
says she's my most important disciple

1162
00:55:57,979 --> 00:55:55,259
you know something along those lines

1163
00:56:00,650 --> 00:55:57,989
that just burned his tail feathers and

1164
00:56:02,650 --> 00:56:00,660
so you know they had to keep keep that

1165
00:56:06,320 --> 00:56:02,660
up but

1166
00:56:07,880 --> 00:56:06,330
and it's that organization now III I

1167
00:56:09,800 --> 00:56:07,890
think there's I'm look just looking

1168
00:56:11,240 --> 00:56:09,810
through the to the comment soon what we

1169
00:56:12,170 --> 00:56:11,250
do about half an hour left on on the

1170
00:56:13,820 --> 00:56:12,180
show so I want to make sure that I don't

1171
00:56:17,810 --> 00:56:13,830
get to a couple questions from from the

1172
00:56:19,880 --> 00:56:17,820
ours as well and so Houdini was the

1173
00:56:21,800 --> 00:56:19,890
reason Dan Ackroyd's dad got into the

1174
00:56:23,150 --> 00:56:21,810
field so actually it seems that Houdini

1175
00:56:26,330 --> 00:56:23,160
was actual one of the reasons why one of

1176
00:56:28,940 --> 00:56:26,340
our Canadian paranormal you know

1177
00:56:31,340 --> 00:56:28,950
celebrity is denn ourself I actually got

1178
00:56:35,630 --> 00:56:31,350
into the business now I'm interested to

1179
00:56:38,420 --> 00:56:35,640
know you know what what connection then

1180
00:56:39,109 --> 00:56:38,430
I'm gonna mispronounce it Hecate alright

1181
00:56:43,790 --> 00:56:39,119
hey

1182
00:56:46,400 --> 00:56:43,800
witchcraft the night moon goes to

1183
00:56:49,220 --> 00:56:46,410
necromancy etc etc is that the same one

1184
00:56:50,960 --> 00:56:49,230
from a Greek gonna see the yeah at while

1185
00:56:52,910 --> 00:56:50,970
she's older than Greek she's one of the

1186
00:56:56,060 --> 00:56:52,920
cathodic goddesses and what you

1187
00:57:00,830 --> 00:56:56,070
described there is just a portion of

1188
00:57:03,890 --> 00:57:00,840
what I mean she's been you know made a

1189
00:57:06,830 --> 00:57:03,900
symbol of in some cases just co-opted

1190
00:57:09,410 --> 00:57:06,840
but you know in indeed yeah but there's

1191
00:57:12,890 --> 00:57:09,420
more to her than than that but yeah

1192
00:57:14,840 --> 00:57:12,900
that's her now she was also identified

1193
00:57:17,810 --> 00:57:14,850
with the goddess as such as Artemis

1194
00:57:21,109 --> 00:57:17,820
Ursuline you know there are other Xena

1195
00:57:23,060 --> 00:57:21,119
Athena for instance uh how does this

1196
00:57:25,060 --> 00:57:23,070
work into the you know the worship of

1197
00:57:29,150 --> 00:57:25,070
her or if this is continuing within

1198
00:57:31,040 --> 00:57:29,160
within the world at large is is it like

1199
00:57:33,530 --> 00:57:31,050
are they actually drawing powers from

1200
00:57:35,150 --> 00:57:33,540
from worship or is this more of a

1201
00:57:37,160 --> 00:57:35,160
delusion that people are just kind of

1202
00:57:37,580 --> 00:57:37,170
doing things because they think it will

1203
00:57:43,370 --> 00:57:37,590
work

1204
00:57:47,810 --> 00:57:43,380
ah interesting let me answer it in this

1205
00:57:50,060 --> 00:57:47,820
in this way hmm when I went into this my

1206
00:57:52,880 --> 00:57:50,070
view and knowledge of Hecate was exactly

1207
00:57:56,420 --> 00:57:52,890
what you described and that was it she

1208
00:58:01,190 --> 00:57:56,430
was that dark sinister goddess of the

1209
00:58:07,030 --> 00:58:01,200
witches and such my view of her now

1210
00:58:12,580 --> 00:58:07,040
after a decade of investigation and they

1211
00:58:14,080 --> 00:58:12,590
experiences in dealing with the lore and

1212
00:58:17,530 --> 00:58:14,090
her presence

1213
00:58:20,020 --> 00:58:17,540
you know thematically in this mystery my

1214
00:58:25,090 --> 00:58:20,030
view of her now is much more expanded

1215
00:58:26,440 --> 00:58:25,100
and different look it's like Rick and I

1216
00:58:27,910 --> 00:58:26,450
say in the first book it's like I

1217
00:58:34,540 --> 00:58:27,920
continued you know in the other two

1218
00:58:37,450 --> 00:58:34,550
books that there there's there's a lot

1219
00:58:43,660 --> 00:58:37,460
of people out there who do things in the

1220
00:58:45,400 --> 00:58:43,670
name of various gods okay which it's

1221
00:58:47,860 --> 00:58:45,410
that no they don't they don't really

1222
00:58:50,110 --> 00:58:47,870
have magic they're not able to pull

1223
00:58:52,420 --> 00:58:50,120
something off you know in a supernatural

1224
00:58:56,860 --> 00:58:52,430
metaphysical way just by invoking these

1225
00:58:59,550 --> 00:58:56,870
these beings these entities so I you

1226
00:59:03,880 --> 00:58:59,560
know I think as I say in the books you

1227
00:59:08,260 --> 00:59:03,890
can be a complete atheist about these

1228
00:59:11,080 --> 00:59:08,270
kinds of things and still see that the

1229
00:59:13,270 --> 00:59:11,090
perpetrators of these suggested crimes

1230
00:59:16,030 --> 00:59:13,280
believed it okay

1231
00:59:20,770 --> 00:59:16,040
so there's there's that level now if

1232
00:59:22,660 --> 00:59:20,780
you're somebody who believes that the

1233
00:59:26,520 --> 00:59:22,670
supernatural exists that there are these

1234
00:59:31,120 --> 00:59:26,530
entities which we have come to call gods

1235
00:59:34,660 --> 00:59:31,130
the view could be stated as yeah I think

1236
00:59:37,300 --> 00:59:34,670
these yeah I think Hecate exists but I

1237
00:59:39,640 --> 00:59:37,310
don't think based on my study of her

1238
00:59:43,080 --> 00:59:39,650
that she really wants to be associated

1239
00:59:46,660 --> 00:59:43,090
with these wackos doing these very dark

1240
00:59:52,120 --> 00:59:46,670
things in questionable things in her

1241
00:59:53,800 --> 00:59:52,130
name okay so it answers your question do

1242
00:59:55,480 --> 00:59:53,810
I think they really had power I think

1243
00:59:57,670 --> 00:59:55,490
they believed they did the people who I

1244
01:00:01,420 --> 00:59:57,680
think were doing these things and in

1245
01:00:03,100 --> 01:00:01,430
using her symbolism and invoking what

1246
01:00:08,020 --> 01:00:03,110
she represents I think they believed

1247
01:00:10,780 --> 01:00:08,030
that they were wielding some power but

1248
01:00:12,540 --> 01:00:10,790
I'd you know obviously I don't think

1249
01:00:14,620 --> 01:00:12,550
they actually wielded a real power now

1250
01:00:17,050 --> 01:00:14,630
here's the thing though

1251
01:00:20,740 --> 01:00:17,060
in the course of the investigation of

1252
01:00:23,950 --> 01:00:20,750
all this I don't talk about me and

1253
01:00:26,170 --> 01:00:23,960
my experiences and my team I had the the

1254
01:00:27,610 --> 01:00:26,180
associates who would be out there in the

1255
01:00:30,280 --> 01:00:27,620
field with me occasionally

1256
01:00:34,470 --> 01:00:30,290
um I don't talk about that aspect the

1257
01:00:37,360 --> 01:00:34,480
investigation of this in the books okay

1258
01:00:40,870 --> 01:00:37,370
but I have talked about it outside the

1259
01:00:44,020 --> 01:00:40,880
books and this thing this decade of

1260
01:00:48,330 --> 01:00:44,030
investigating this in my exposure to all

1261
01:00:51,970 --> 01:00:48,340
things Hecate have had deep impact on me

1262
01:00:56,860 --> 01:00:51,980
yeah there were experiences there very

1263
01:00:59,650 --> 01:00:56,870
strange things happened also it was

1264
01:01:01,330 --> 01:00:59,660
really my major just jumping in all the

1265
01:01:03,760 --> 01:01:01,340
way not sticking the toe in the waters

1266
01:01:07,510 --> 01:01:03,770
you know it was more like I was pushed

1267
01:01:10,780 --> 01:01:07,520
in where synchronicity is concerned Wow

1268
01:01:20,680 --> 01:01:10,790
I mean that's a week's worth of shows in

1269
01:01:23,560 --> 01:01:20,690
itself so on the superficial practical

1270
01:01:25,000 --> 01:01:23,570
level no I don't think these people were

1271
01:01:28,180 --> 01:01:25,010
wielding any real power

1272
01:01:32,010 --> 01:01:28,190
on the deeper level do I think

1273
01:01:33,970 --> 01:01:32,020
something's there that is potentially

1274
01:01:36,580 --> 01:01:33,980
metaphysical or what we call

1275
01:01:40,360 --> 01:01:36,590
supernatural or beyond what you can

1276
01:01:44,140 --> 01:01:40,370
plainly see yeah yeah

1277
01:01:45,640 --> 01:01:44,150
it lets itself be known when you my my

1278
01:01:47,860 --> 01:01:45,650
co-author in the first book Rick Spence

1279
01:01:49,270 --> 01:01:47,870
who came to it he lives in Idaho he

1280
01:01:53,980 --> 01:01:49,280
wasn't part of the investigation he

1281
01:01:56,140 --> 01:01:53,990
brought a scholarly contribution to it

1282
01:01:58,480 --> 01:01:56,150
that I just had to ask him to be the

1283
01:02:00,730 --> 01:01:58,490
co-author he has said in other

1284
01:02:02,850 --> 01:02:00,740
interviews and to me that he didn't

1285
01:02:05,440 --> 01:02:02,860
really put much stock in synchronicity

1286
01:02:09,370 --> 01:02:05,450
and things like that

1287
01:02:11,800 --> 01:02:09,380
until he met me and he started working

1288
01:02:14,920 --> 01:02:11,810
on the book with me and then he began to

1289
01:02:18,520 --> 01:02:14,930
see and experience some weird stuff

1290
01:02:20,440 --> 01:02:18,530
himself and still as strange as it is

1291
01:02:24,130 --> 01:02:20,450
and as dramatic as it can be at times I

1292
01:02:25,990 --> 01:02:24,140
just felt like you know when I'm I don't

1293
01:02:27,790 --> 01:02:26,000
put that in the books because the books

1294
01:02:30,610 --> 01:02:27,800
aren't about me and what's happening to

1295
01:02:31,930 --> 01:02:30,620
me it's about what I'm investigating now

1296
01:02:34,570 --> 01:02:31,940
here's what's interesting to bring it

1297
01:02:40,410 --> 01:02:34,580
back to the TV show they will

1298
01:02:42,250 --> 01:02:40,420
depicting me and my investigation and

1299
01:02:44,470 --> 01:02:42,260
people are gonna get a little more

1300
01:02:46,960 --> 01:02:44,480
insight into the things that I you know

1301
01:02:52,600 --> 01:02:46,970
went through they aren't in the books if

1302
01:02:55,840 --> 01:02:52,610
you know this TV show flies so now how

1303
01:02:56,950 --> 01:02:55,850
is the production process been as far as

1304
01:03:00,940 --> 01:02:56,960
collaboration between you and the

1305
01:03:03,000 --> 01:03:00,950
producers from someone who's seen a few

1306
01:03:05,410 --> 01:03:03,010
TV shows and movies turned into or

1307
01:03:08,410 --> 01:03:05,420
shouldn't say TV shows and movies that

1308
01:03:11,050 --> 01:03:08,420
have been born from beloved works and

1309
01:03:15,250 --> 01:03:11,060
you know I'll reference the sort of

1310
01:03:17,920 --> 01:03:15,260
truth series from Terry Goodkind and you

1311
01:03:21,100 --> 01:03:17,930
know they turned probably one of the

1312
01:03:24,060 --> 01:03:21,110
most impactful pieces of literature at

1313
01:03:27,000 --> 01:03:24,070
least to my life in in the last 15 years

1314
01:03:29,410 --> 01:03:27,010
just from a philosophically and point

1315
01:03:34,290 --> 01:03:29,420
essentially into you know Xena Warrior

1316
01:03:38,080 --> 01:03:34,300
Princess sort of truth and right it's

1317
01:03:42,040 --> 01:03:38,090
because well so I'm hoping yeah yeah

1318
01:03:45,760 --> 01:03:42,050
yeah and and and I get what you're

1319
01:03:48,670 --> 01:03:45,770
asking it's here's the thing the very

1320
01:03:56,550 --> 01:03:48,680
first conversation I had with the

1321
01:04:00,490 --> 01:03:56,560
producer about Empire the wheel was she

1322
01:04:03,670 --> 01:04:00,500
impressed me immediately that she had

1323
01:04:05,260 --> 01:04:03,680
read the material that she had heard me

1324
01:04:08,640 --> 01:04:05,270
talking about this because she said I

1325
01:04:11,740 --> 01:04:08,650
heard you talk about this and that and

1326
01:04:14,440 --> 01:04:11,750
there there's a particular show that I

1327
01:04:16,420 --> 01:04:14,450
happen to love it's one of the best

1328
01:04:19,510 --> 01:04:16,430
things ever done on television and she

1329
01:04:22,300 --> 01:04:19,520
said the way I see Empire the wheel it

1330
01:04:24,040 --> 01:04:22,310
should have the tone and feel of this

1331
01:04:27,400 --> 01:04:24,050
particular show and when she said that

1332
01:04:29,440 --> 01:04:27,410
unsolicited by me my my confidence level

1333
01:04:33,010 --> 01:04:29,450
in her you know kind of spiked right

1334
01:04:36,910 --> 01:04:33,020
there cuz I said oh yeah definitely

1335
01:04:38,590 --> 01:04:36,920
definitely now it is going to be a

1336
01:04:40,720 --> 01:04:38,600
dramatic series it's not going to be a

1337
01:04:43,180 --> 01:04:40,730
documentary or docudrama thing it's

1338
01:04:45,760 --> 01:04:43,190
gonna be actors and stuff so you on the

1339
01:04:47,740 --> 01:04:45,770
one hand you do have to say okay there's

1340
01:04:48,670 --> 01:04:47,750
going to be some dramatic license

1341
01:04:50,680 --> 01:04:48,680
they're going to

1342
01:04:52,630 --> 01:04:50,690
have to take in order to tell this story

1343
01:04:57,609 --> 01:04:52,640
and get it out there in an entertaining

1344
01:05:00,390 --> 01:04:57,619
fashion but I will say this when she you

1345
01:05:04,120 --> 01:05:00,400
know she mentioned from the beginning

1346
01:05:06,400 --> 01:05:04,130
that she thinks it should have the feel

1347
01:05:08,200 --> 01:05:06,410
of true detective season one you know

1348
01:05:10,720 --> 01:05:08,210
that's the show I'm talking about I said

1349
01:05:12,280 --> 01:05:10,730
oh yeah she gets Empire of the wheel she

1350
01:05:13,960 --> 01:05:12,290
gets him by the way that was part of the

1351
01:05:15,309 --> 01:05:13,970
reason I loved and I'm not going off on

1352
01:05:16,480 --> 01:05:15,319
a tangent I'm gonna bring it back

1353
01:05:20,260 --> 01:05:16,490
because I got something else to say

1354
01:05:23,290 --> 01:05:20,270
about this production but when I first

1355
01:05:24,970 --> 01:05:23,300
saw true detective season 1 I told

1356
01:05:26,920 --> 01:05:24,980
family members that were watching it

1357
01:05:30,160 --> 01:05:26,930
with me I said look at this this is how

1358
01:05:31,839 --> 01:05:30,170
it felt okay to be investigating the

1359
01:05:32,859 --> 01:05:31,849
impaired the wheel mystery it gave me

1360
01:05:34,329 --> 01:05:32,869
goosebumps I'm getting goosebumps

1361
01:05:37,120 --> 01:05:34,339
talking about it right now

1362
01:05:40,150 --> 01:05:37,130
I was like oh my god I get what rust and

1363
01:05:42,430 --> 01:05:40,160
Marty or I Wow okay and so when this

1364
01:05:45,190 --> 01:05:42,440
producer independently

1365
01:05:47,079 --> 01:05:45,200
you know without my provoking it said I

1366
01:05:49,599 --> 01:05:47,089
see Empire the wheel is something like

1367
01:05:52,089 --> 01:05:49,609
true detective specifically season one I

1368
01:05:54,839 --> 01:05:52,099
was like okay she gets it so my

1369
01:05:58,839 --> 01:05:54,849
confidence level spiked and since then

1370
01:06:01,359 --> 01:05:58,849
she and her development writer have you

1371
01:06:04,660 --> 01:06:01,369
know we've they've asked me numerous

1372
01:06:07,480 --> 01:06:04,670
questions and I've given them volumes of

1373
01:06:11,140 --> 01:06:07,490
answer in emails and in conversations on

1374
01:06:14,200 --> 01:06:11,150
the phone they're they're really they're

1375
01:06:15,789 --> 01:06:14,210
really wanting all the details I shared

1376
01:06:18,220 --> 01:06:15,799
it all with them the stuff that's not in

1377
01:06:20,349 --> 01:06:18,230
the books I mean I shared it all with

1378
01:06:23,109 --> 01:06:20,359
them and they just they're always coming

1379
01:06:25,000 --> 01:06:23,119
back with lots of questions about you

1380
01:06:26,770 --> 01:06:25,010
know not just the material that's in the

1381
01:06:30,549 --> 01:06:26,780
book but about my personal experience

1382
01:06:33,910 --> 01:06:30,559
with investigating this and so I have

1383
01:06:35,799 --> 01:06:33,920
been in a satisfactory level this has

1384
01:06:37,359 --> 01:06:35,809
not been a case where they paid me a

1385
01:06:40,120 --> 01:06:37,369
little bit of option money and then said

1386
01:06:44,020 --> 01:06:40,130
thank you go away not at all not by any

1387
01:06:46,329 --> 01:06:44,030
means I've been very involved with them

1388
01:06:47,920 --> 01:06:46,339
with them and the input you know they're

1389
01:06:49,270 --> 01:06:47,930
writing it it's theirs to write that's

1390
01:06:51,490 --> 01:06:49,280
the way it works I'm not a Harlan

1391
01:06:53,049 --> 01:06:51,500
Ellison as much as I love that Hannon

1392
01:06:56,260 --> 01:06:53,059
and he's an original

1393
01:06:58,630 --> 01:06:56,270
I'm no Harlan Ellison you know I'm not

1394
01:07:00,280 --> 01:06:58,640
gonna you know it all remains to be seen

1395
01:07:02,440 --> 01:07:00,290
of course you know if they turn it into

1396
01:07:04,780 --> 01:07:02,450
a cartoon with Smurfs and we'll all be

1397
01:07:08,920 --> 01:07:04,790
disappointed but I can confidently say

1398
01:07:11,940 --> 01:07:08,930
that they're doing their best so that

1399
01:07:14,770 --> 01:07:11,950
this will be you know something

1400
01:07:17,620 --> 01:07:14,780
something that I especially will

1401
01:07:20,109 --> 01:07:17,630
recognize and readers will will will

1402
01:07:25,240 --> 01:07:20,119
recognize now who do you hope to play

1403
01:07:28,180 --> 01:07:25,250
you you know what I'll tell you what I

1404
01:07:29,380 --> 01:07:28,190
told the producer I said before you guys

1405
01:07:31,270 --> 01:07:29,390
come out because they're gonna come out

1406
01:07:33,130 --> 01:07:31,280
and I'm gonna give them the tour they're

1407
01:07:35,650 --> 01:07:33,140
gonna see where course Stanton's buried

1408
01:07:37,300 --> 01:07:35,660
and all that I said give me a few weeks

1409
01:07:38,740 --> 01:07:37,310
so I can lose weight cuz like you know I

1410
01:07:40,630 --> 01:07:38,750
don't want you to I don't want you to

1411
01:07:43,750 --> 01:07:40,640
cast it you know a middle-aged fat guy

1412
01:07:45,880 --> 01:07:43,760
playing me yeah but look let me trim off

1413
01:07:47,829 --> 01:07:45,890
a few and get the right haircut you know

1414
01:07:52,240 --> 01:07:47,839
we laughed and joked about that but you

1415
01:07:54,730 --> 01:07:52,250
know I I don't know I hesitant to say

1416
01:07:56,319 --> 01:07:54,740
who other people have said should play

1417
01:07:57,609 --> 01:07:56,329
me because then you know I'm gonna say

1418
01:08:01,690 --> 01:07:57,619
that people are going to go are you kid

1419
01:08:03,880 --> 01:08:01,700
I I don't know that's part of the fun

1420
01:08:06,099 --> 01:08:03,890
that's gonna be part of the fun

1421
01:08:11,980 --> 01:08:06,109
you know most of the story is gonna be

1422
01:08:14,530 --> 01:08:11,990
what happened in 1915 so well if George

1423
01:08:17,530 --> 01:08:14,540
Clooney if you're watching this I'm

1424
01:08:20,079 --> 01:08:17,540
telling you for for a couple of days

1425
01:08:22,479 --> 01:08:20,089
work maybe a couple weeks I think he'd

1426
01:08:26,140 --> 01:08:22,489
be perfect well others have said Jeffrey

1427
01:08:28,450 --> 01:08:26,150
Dean Morgan I my adopted kid when I was

1428
01:08:30,910 --> 01:08:28,460
in a phase where I had really like you

1429
01:08:33,640 --> 01:08:30,920
know gotten thin thinner than she had

1430
01:08:35,590 --> 01:08:33,650
ever seen she was looking at a picture

1431
01:08:37,539 --> 01:08:35,600
of Jeffrey Dean Morgan and going oh hey

1432
01:08:40,959 --> 01:08:37,549
you know what and I'd never thought of

1433
01:08:43,180 --> 01:08:40,969
that but apparently you know um but I I

1434
01:08:45,039 --> 01:08:43,190
don't know I don't know hey you know

1435
01:08:46,840 --> 01:08:45,049
I'll be happy whoever they get because

1436
01:08:48,420 --> 01:08:46,850
I'll tell you the fact that this is even

1437
01:08:53,349 --> 01:08:48,430
happening and that they're doing this

1438
01:08:56,729 --> 01:08:53,359
I'm very excited and flattered and just

1439
01:09:01,360 --> 01:08:56,739
you know whoever they get I think we'll

1440
01:09:03,640 --> 01:09:01,370
have some good material you know in fact

1441
01:09:04,660 --> 01:09:03,650
there's there's some good characters in

1442
01:09:08,289 --> 01:09:04,670
here

1443
01:09:10,539 --> 01:09:08,299
Minoo whatever actor you know female

1444
01:09:14,050 --> 01:09:10,549
actor they get to play the mysterious

1445
01:09:16,660 --> 01:09:14,060
chorus Stanton you know cuz Cora she's

1446
01:09:20,050 --> 01:09:16,670
the real the real star of the

1447
01:09:22,360 --> 01:09:20,060
the whole mystery and that's that's

1448
01:09:25,600 --> 01:09:22,370
gonna be interesting to see you know

1449
01:09:29,470 --> 01:09:25,610
when they get that far who they start

1450
01:09:31,840 --> 01:09:29,480
casting and if I know it's it's stolen

1451
01:09:34,120 --> 01:09:31,850
development stage yes they're an

1452
01:09:36,250 --> 01:09:34,130
expected date we could you see a pilots

1453
01:09:37,900 --> 01:09:36,260
or is it kind of up in the air at the

1454
01:09:41,530 --> 01:09:37,910
moment that's up in the air because the

1455
01:09:42,760 --> 01:09:41,540
way these things work if they pitch for

1456
01:09:45,340 --> 01:09:42,770
example I'm just throwing this out there

1457
01:09:48,610 --> 01:09:45,350
if they pitch and it gets greenlit in

1458
01:09:51,880 --> 01:09:48,620
September next month right you're

1459
01:09:54,100 --> 01:09:51,890
talking it would be my gosh they would

1460
01:09:55,660 --> 01:09:54,110
have to go through pre-production they

1461
01:09:57,040 --> 01:09:55,670
would have to you know write a whole

1462
01:09:59,230 --> 01:09:57,050
season of scripts while they're doing

1463
01:10:01,150 --> 01:09:59,240
that right and then they would have to

1464
01:10:03,430 --> 01:10:01,160
cast the thing and then while they're

1465
01:10:05,800 --> 01:10:03,440
doing that they've got to find locations

1466
01:10:08,020 --> 01:10:05,810
they want to use or then the studio

1467
01:10:10,060 --> 01:10:08,030
space blah blah blah so forth and then

1468
01:10:12,130 --> 01:10:10,070
actually doing them you're talking at

1469
01:10:14,830 --> 01:10:12,140
least at least a year

1470
01:10:19,870 --> 01:10:14,840
I'm guessing before the first episode

1471
01:10:22,000 --> 01:10:19,880
would hit TV so depending upon when they

1472
01:10:24,130 --> 01:10:22,010
pitch you can better now I could be

1473
01:10:26,770 --> 01:10:24,140
totally wrong the producer could say oh

1474
01:10:29,260 --> 01:10:26,780
heck no Walter we're kind of working

1475
01:10:31,450 --> 01:10:29,270
that out already you know a lot of that

1476
01:10:33,250 --> 01:10:31,460
already so as soon as it's greenlit and

1477
01:10:35,650 --> 01:10:33,260
we get the big chunk of money for

1478
01:10:37,960 --> 01:10:35,660
production we're ahead of the game and

1479
01:10:39,670 --> 01:10:37,970
it would definitely be you know say a

1480
01:10:41,740 --> 01:10:39,680
year or whatever and then you got to

1481
01:10:43,270 --> 01:10:41,750
realize whatever Network it is they have

1482
01:10:45,040 --> 01:10:43,280
to figure out you know when they're open

1483
01:10:47,500 --> 01:10:45,050
slot is and when they would want to

1484
01:10:49,810 --> 01:10:47,510
premiere it so but we're talking you

1485
01:10:52,180 --> 01:10:49,820
know realistically probably within a

1486
01:10:54,430 --> 01:10:52,190
year year and a half one it's [\h__\h]

1487
01:10:57,130 --> 01:10:54,440
that's my best guess based on my limited

1488
01:10:58,570 --> 01:10:57,140
knowledge of this now you also have a

1489
01:11:01,060 --> 01:10:58,580
new book that's going to be coming out

1490
01:11:03,670 --> 01:11:01,070
in the near future it can you give us a

1491
01:11:06,070 --> 01:11:03,680
little bit of a preview about that well

1492
01:11:07,720 --> 01:11:06,080
I have a policy that I never revealed

1493
01:11:09,880 --> 01:11:07,730
the specifics of what a book is about

1494
01:11:11,500 --> 01:11:09,890
until I release the cover art which is

1495
01:11:14,890 --> 01:11:11,510
usually two weeks before the book is

1496
01:11:17,560 --> 01:11:14,900
released but I can say it's the forth in

1497
01:11:21,190 --> 01:11:17,570
the secret missions series it is about

1498
01:11:24,160 --> 01:11:21,200
another historical figure about whom I'm

1499
01:11:27,010 --> 01:11:24,170
finding things I never knew that within

1500
01:11:27,970 --> 01:11:27,020
the context of this particular series of

1501
01:11:30,229 --> 01:11:27,980
books

1502
01:11:33,049 --> 01:11:30,239
suggests to me that

1503
01:11:36,020 --> 01:11:33,059
there was more going on than history

1504
01:11:38,299 --> 01:11:36,030
usually likes to point to and you know

1505
01:11:41,959 --> 01:11:38,309
maybe some doozies in there that will be

1506
01:11:44,180 --> 01:11:41,969
my you know my famous speculations I

1507
01:11:50,479 --> 01:11:44,190
like to throw out there on the limb of

1508
01:11:53,089 --> 01:11:50,489
speculation I will say that I'm this one

1509
01:11:54,560 --> 01:11:53,099
has the field that my secret missions

1510
01:11:57,919 --> 01:11:54,570
number two about Sir Richard Francis

1511
01:12:00,229 --> 01:11:57,929
Burton when I was researching that this

1512
01:12:03,589 --> 01:12:00,239
one's feeling like that and that Burton

1513
01:12:06,819 --> 01:12:03,599
book is my fav for the series I like but

1514
01:12:11,569 --> 01:12:06,829
that one I really and it's it's the it's

1515
01:12:15,140 --> 01:12:11,579
it's just a real big piece of meat to

1516
01:12:18,169 --> 01:12:15,150
naan and and this one's really this this

1517
01:12:20,979 --> 01:12:18,179
one's I'm really energized at what I'm

1518
01:12:23,060 --> 01:12:20,989
I'm finding is I pull these threads so

1519
01:12:25,390 --> 01:12:23,070
for the final segment we've got we've

1520
01:12:28,520 --> 01:12:25,400
got about 15 minutes or we're so left

1521
01:12:31,910 --> 01:12:28,530
okay this question is coming in from one

1522
01:12:35,060 --> 01:12:31,920
of my dear brothers Stephen dieter and

1523
01:12:36,589 --> 01:12:35,070
he actually studied Houdini as a child

1524
01:12:37,850 --> 01:12:36,599
which is pretty cool probably one of the

1525
01:12:40,640 --> 01:12:37,860
reasons I think he probably knows your

1526
01:12:42,410 --> 01:12:40,650
work so it's like Stephen I hope you're

1527
01:12:45,830 --> 01:12:42,420
doing well hope that mustache is as

1528
01:12:48,770 --> 01:12:45,840
fantastic as ever presuming the United

1529
01:12:51,319 --> 01:12:48,780
States space force has an acceptable

1530
01:12:54,049 --> 01:12:51,329
mandate and acceptable concept for

1531
01:12:56,600 --> 01:12:54,059
whatever it's order of battle will be in

1532
01:12:58,640 --> 01:12:56,610
terms of troops equipment and so on by

1533
01:13:01,160 --> 01:12:58,650
what means will this force be measured

1534
01:13:02,600 --> 01:13:01,170
at least in your opinion you know armies

1535
01:13:04,009 --> 01:13:02,610
are usually measured by themselves in

1536
01:13:05,509 --> 01:13:04,019
battlefield standards and by the

1537
01:13:06,169 --> 01:13:05,519
performance on the field against their

1538
01:13:10,220 --> 01:13:06,179
adversary

1539
01:13:11,450 --> 01:13:10,230
if the USSF going is I should say is the

1540
01:13:16,069 --> 01:13:11,460
USSF going to be measured against the

1541
01:13:19,129 --> 01:13:16,079
CIS SF the margin or Martian SF the

1542
01:13:20,600 --> 01:13:19,139
Vulcan SF and where is the funding and

1543
01:13:29,080 --> 01:13:20,610
Technology going to come from do you

1544
01:13:32,390 --> 01:13:29,090
think the funding you know usually comes

1545
01:13:36,830 --> 01:13:32,400
embedded in look Catherine Austin Fitz

1546
01:13:40,569 --> 01:13:36,840
has done a lot of great work - yeah you

1547
01:13:44,349 --> 01:13:40,579
know to explain that the secret

1548
01:13:46,689 --> 01:13:44,359
for secret space program is probably one

1549
01:13:48,549 --> 01:13:46,699
of the if not the best explanation for

1550
01:13:50,979 --> 01:13:48,559
these stories we've heard for 40 years

1551
01:13:52,929 --> 01:13:50,989
about toilet seats that cost five

1552
01:13:54,849 --> 01:13:52,939
thousand dollars and Crescent wrenches

1553
01:13:56,649 --> 01:13:54,859
that cost fifteen thousand dollars

1554
01:13:57,939 --> 01:13:56,659
obviously the toilet seat in the

1555
01:14:01,089 --> 01:13:57,949
Crescent wrenches didn't cost that much

1556
01:14:03,219 --> 01:14:01,099
but they were embedding the cost for

1557
01:14:07,839 --> 01:14:03,229
some type of classified programs or

1558
01:14:12,279 --> 01:14:07,849
program within mundane objects okay so

1559
01:14:15,009 --> 01:14:12,289
the the funding is look for things like

1560
01:14:16,719 --> 01:14:15,019
that or go look at Katherine Austin Fitz

1561
01:14:18,189 --> 01:14:16,729
work on this this is the kind of thing

1562
01:14:21,699 --> 01:14:18,199
that made her a believer in the idea

1563
01:14:23,229 --> 01:14:21,709
that there you know is a secret space

1564
01:14:25,000 --> 01:14:23,239
program possibly a breakaway

1565
01:14:27,520 --> 01:14:25,010
civilization is when she started looking

1566
01:14:30,389 --> 01:14:27,530
at stuff like this now the technology I

1567
01:14:32,979 --> 01:14:30,399
would argue that the technology remember

1568
01:14:36,579 --> 01:14:32,989
everybody gets this idea that it's gonna

1569
01:14:39,250 --> 01:14:36,589
be some Starfleet level stuff or then it

1570
01:14:42,459 --> 01:14:39,260
is Starfleet level stuff no it's not

1571
01:14:44,649 --> 01:14:42,469
it's probably technology that's not that

1572
01:14:49,919 --> 01:14:44,659
far ahead of what we know we have in

1573
01:14:53,229 --> 01:14:49,929
space right now I argue that our

1574
01:14:56,560 --> 01:14:53,239
interplanetary craft for you know let's

1575
01:14:59,229 --> 01:14:56,570
call it that there are probably closer

1576
01:15:01,779 --> 01:14:59,239
to a naval submarine than people have

1577
01:15:03,159 --> 01:15:01,789
probably imagined think about it a naval

1578
01:15:04,089 --> 01:15:03,169
submarine they've been doing submarines

1579
01:15:07,089 --> 01:15:04,099
for a hundred years

1580
01:15:10,149 --> 01:15:07,099
pretty expertly and what that is is a

1581
01:15:11,770 --> 01:15:10,159
self-contained with life support system

1582
01:15:14,649 --> 01:15:11,780
craft that operates in a hostile

1583
01:15:16,239 --> 01:15:14,659
environment well think about that if you

1584
01:15:18,909 --> 01:15:16,249
want to look at interplanetary vessels

1585
01:15:20,679 --> 01:15:18,919
like that then the US Navy and other

1586
01:15:23,949 --> 01:15:20,689
navies of the world any Navy that's had

1587
01:15:26,889 --> 01:15:23,959
a submarine fleet has been doing space

1588
01:15:29,290 --> 01:15:26,899
ships for a century now while you gotta

1589
01:15:33,669 --> 01:15:29,300
do is put it up there instead of under

1590
01:15:36,069 --> 01:15:33,679
the water so I really am vehemently

1591
01:15:39,609 --> 01:15:36,079
opposed to this ridiculous notion that

1592
01:15:45,189 --> 01:15:39,619
the secret space program is or has to be

1593
01:15:47,889 --> 01:15:45,199
you know supplied with these starship

1594
01:15:50,529 --> 01:15:47,899
enterprises and this ridiculous you know

1595
01:15:52,299 --> 01:15:50,539
five centuries down the road technology

1596
01:15:54,580 --> 01:15:52,309
that that is that is ridiculous it's

1597
01:15:57,190 --> 01:15:54,590
it's probably technology you would wreck

1598
01:16:00,070 --> 01:15:57,200
nice just a little more when I say a

1599
01:16:03,250 --> 01:16:00,080
little more I'm talking you know you

1600
01:16:06,250 --> 01:16:03,260
know somewhere around 50 years yeah

1601
01:16:09,670 --> 01:16:06,260
maybe a hundred advance beyond what

1602
01:16:12,580 --> 01:16:09,680
we're using that you know about and I

1603
01:16:14,350 --> 01:16:12,590
think there's probably only about if I

1604
01:16:15,940 --> 01:16:14,360
had to guess in a secret space program

1605
01:16:19,780 --> 01:16:15,950
before the space force which is going to

1606
01:16:21,280 --> 01:16:19,790
be public I would I have estimated that

1607
01:16:24,610 --> 01:16:21,290
there's probably only nine or ten

1608
01:16:27,190 --> 01:16:24,620
thousand personnel that are involved in

1609
01:16:29,710 --> 01:16:27,200
the secret space program 100%

1610
01:16:30,940 --> 01:16:29,720
knowledgeable that they are in a secret

1611
01:16:32,410 --> 01:16:30,950
space program that they're actually

1612
01:16:34,690 --> 01:16:32,420
offered you know involved with

1613
01:16:37,690 --> 01:16:34,700
operations in space I think that there's

1614
01:16:41,350 --> 01:16:37,700
probably a lot of support personnel that

1615
01:16:43,300 --> 01:16:41,360
are supporting something classified and

1616
01:16:45,490 --> 01:16:43,310
but they're they they may not know to

1617
01:16:47,920 --> 01:16:45,500
varying degrees that it's a secret space

1618
01:16:50,440 --> 01:16:47,930
program so we're talking you know not a

1619
01:16:53,020 --> 01:16:50,450
very big there's 18,000 people I think

1620
01:16:55,780 --> 01:16:53,030
that are needed to run NASA if I may I

1621
01:16:58,450 --> 01:16:55,790
think only half of that is my guess my

1622
01:17:00,250 --> 01:16:58,460
suggested speculative guess as to how

1623
01:17:02,350 --> 01:17:00,260
many people would be in a secret space

1624
01:17:04,930 --> 01:17:02,360
program so as far as who they'll be

1625
01:17:07,450 --> 01:17:04,940
measured by the space force remember

1626
01:17:09,250 --> 01:17:07,460
most of their operations are probably

1627
01:17:10,930 --> 01:17:09,260
going to be in support of earth-based

1628
01:17:13,450 --> 01:17:10,940
conflicts okay

1629
01:17:16,540 --> 01:17:13,460
there's there a space force that's where

1630
01:17:19,180 --> 01:17:16,550
they're gonna be based okay that's where

1631
01:17:21,610 --> 01:17:19,190
their operations will be focused you

1632
01:17:24,310 --> 01:17:21,620
know in and from space what does that

1633
01:17:26,140 --> 01:17:24,320
mean if you need a force to get from

1634
01:17:28,240 --> 01:17:26,150
here to the battlefield on the other

1635
01:17:30,550 --> 01:17:28,250
side of the world fast you're gonna send

1636
01:17:32,380 --> 01:17:30,560
your space base guys because they can be

1637
01:17:35,410 --> 01:17:32,390
there in minutes okay

1638
01:17:39,700 --> 01:17:35,420
and they can strike from above okay so

1639
01:17:43,090 --> 01:17:39,710
the space force I know and I have no

1640
01:17:45,130 --> 01:17:43,100
problem with this what you know I'm sure

1641
01:17:46,420 --> 01:17:45,140
there's somebody out there I think

1642
01:17:50,590 --> 01:17:46,430
there's probably some threat out there

1643
01:17:51,850 --> 01:17:50,600
but let's remember that a lot of the

1644
01:17:54,370 --> 01:17:51,860
application we're going to know about

1645
01:17:56,770 --> 01:17:54,380
initially in C is going to be how this

1646
01:17:59,670 --> 01:17:56,780
space force can support ground

1647
01:18:01,390 --> 01:17:59,680
operations in earth-based conflicts

1648
01:18:04,330 --> 01:18:01,400
fascinating and thank you very much for

1649
01:18:06,490 --> 01:18:04,340
answering that this last question I'm

1650
01:18:07,480 --> 01:18:06,500
Lea I know you last to one was at the

1651
01:18:08,500 --> 01:18:07,490
beginning of the show so I'm going to

1652
01:18:10,600 --> 01:18:08,510
make this a do

1653
01:18:12,820 --> 01:18:10,610
one do you think that the government

1654
01:18:17,320 --> 01:18:12,830
actually has a Richard Dean Anderson

1655
01:18:19,360 --> 01:18:17,330
style Stargate program and second part

1656
01:18:22,420 --> 01:18:19,370
being what do you think of the Dyke

1657
01:18:24,490 --> 01:18:22,430
Lahore and the Germans anti-gravity

1658
01:18:29,350 --> 01:18:24,500
technology or supposed anti-gravity

1659
01:18:32,230 --> 01:18:29,360
technology um real quick die Glocke of

1660
01:18:36,430 --> 01:18:32,240
the Bell and I've written about this in

1661
01:18:38,560 --> 01:18:36,440
my book origin the Bell did not

1662
01:18:43,320 --> 01:18:38,570
originate with the Nazis in my opinion

1663
01:18:47,380 --> 01:18:43,330
they inherited the basic concept and

1664
01:18:50,530 --> 01:18:47,390
prototype technology from an older

1665
01:18:54,670 --> 01:18:50,540
German organization which I write about

1666
01:18:56,560 --> 01:18:54,680
the book origin and it's it's it's a

1667
01:19:00,040 --> 01:18:56,570
technology that had been fooled with by

1668
01:19:03,190 --> 01:19:00,050
human beings for a long time I do not

1669
01:19:06,220 --> 01:19:03,200
for even a second think that this Bell

1670
01:19:09,430 --> 01:19:06,230
this die Glocke uh technology came from

1671
01:19:12,130 --> 01:19:09,440
a reversed engineered crashed ET craft I

1672
01:19:13,120 --> 01:19:12,140
know when you look close at the evidence

1673
01:19:17,550 --> 01:19:13,130
sorry folks

1674
01:19:20,830 --> 01:19:17,560
there is equally astonishing a very

1675
01:19:24,880 --> 01:19:20,840
down-to-earth no pun intended human

1676
01:19:30,340 --> 01:19:24,890
history thread for the bell the glocca

1677
01:19:32,320 --> 01:19:30,350
now as far as the stargate thing no not

1678
01:19:34,060 --> 01:19:32,330
exactly i don't think there's a Stargate

1679
01:19:36,040 --> 01:19:34,070
program you know there's not this

1680
01:19:42,040 --> 01:19:36,050
ridiculous notion the jump room to time

1681
01:19:44,290 --> 01:19:42,050
however I do think that they've been

1682
01:19:47,170 --> 01:19:44,300
messing that they've been experimenting

1683
01:19:50,050 --> 01:19:47,180
with the concepts for probably longer

1684
01:19:52,810 --> 01:19:50,060
than people might think so

1685
01:19:55,000 --> 01:19:52,820
there's no full-fledged Stargate thing

1686
01:19:56,770 --> 01:19:55,010
like you see in the TV show but have

1687
01:19:58,240 --> 01:19:56,780
that has somebody been experimenting

1688
01:20:00,310 --> 01:19:58,250
with in messing with the concepts of

1689
01:20:02,740 --> 01:20:00,320
that kind of technology yes I think so

1690
01:20:04,630 --> 01:20:02,750
well and what do you think and this is

1691
01:20:07,360 --> 01:20:04,640
just my own personal question what do

1692
01:20:09,210 --> 01:20:07,370
you think of the rumor that the Germans

1693
01:20:11,860 --> 01:20:09,220
actually had developed a rudimentary

1694
01:20:15,280 --> 01:20:11,870
nuclear device of some kind and actually

1695
01:20:16,780 --> 01:20:15,290
tested it on the battlefield I don't

1696
01:20:19,740 --> 01:20:16,790
think they tested it on the battlefield

1697
01:20:22,240 --> 01:20:19,750
I think they tested it in the the

1698
01:20:24,640 --> 01:20:22,250
thüringen forth I

1699
01:20:26,650 --> 01:20:24,650
I believe they I'm convinced of the

1700
01:20:29,500 --> 01:20:26,660
evidence that they tested it in a forest

1701
01:20:32,670 --> 01:20:29,510
in Germany and that they very probably

1702
01:20:37,330 --> 01:20:32,680
also tested one in a on a Pacific atoll

1703
01:20:39,820 --> 01:20:37,340
with the Japanese observing there's been

1704
01:20:42,820 --> 01:20:39,830
people right about this and their

1705
01:20:46,090 --> 01:20:42,830
evidence they point to has to do with

1706
01:20:50,350 --> 01:20:46,100
things that were Declassified by the UK

1707
01:20:52,930 --> 01:20:50,360
in the 1990s so yeah I think I think

1708
01:20:57,190 --> 01:20:52,940
it's very convincing that the Germans

1709
01:20:59,620 --> 01:20:57,200
had developed an atomic weapon and that

1710
01:21:01,210 --> 01:20:59,630
was part of the race as to why we really

1711
01:21:02,730 --> 01:21:01,220
needed to get ours going and make it

1712
01:21:05,740 --> 01:21:02,740
happen

1713
01:21:08,170 --> 01:21:05,750
know it's credible that's my answer is

1714
01:21:09,940 --> 01:21:08,180
yes I think it's credible perfect and

1715
01:21:13,030 --> 01:21:09,950
just be able to finish off where can

1716
01:21:15,100 --> 01:21:13,040
people get empire of the wheel it is

1717
01:21:18,190 --> 01:21:15,110
available my books are available print

1718
01:21:20,170 --> 01:21:18,200
on demand only because Amazon is not

1719
01:21:22,180 --> 01:21:20,180
good for independent authors nor small

1720
01:21:24,280 --> 01:21:22,190
press publishers so I pulled my stuff

1721
01:21:29,110 --> 01:21:24,290
from Amazon it is available only at

1722
01:21:31,750 --> 01:21:29,120
lulu.com Lu Lu calm put in my name or

1723
01:21:34,150 --> 01:21:31,760
put in Empire of the wheel in the search

1724
01:21:36,520 --> 01:21:34,160
and you'll be taken to my page where I

1725
01:21:38,830 --> 01:21:36,530
sell my books and you'll find all my

1726
01:21:42,400 --> 01:21:38,840
nonfiction as well as my pulp fiction

1727
01:21:46,210 --> 01:21:42,410
there lulu.com perfect and I'm going to

1728
01:21:50,620 --> 01:21:46,220
be able to post that I'm misspelling

1729
01:21:52,840 --> 01:21:50,630
Amazon right now and as you know not

1730
01:21:57,550 --> 01:21:52,850
Amazon that's a loot or not Amazon or

1731
01:21:57,910 --> 01:21:57,560
not lose Amazon I'd and as on there we

1732
01:22:01,330 --> 01:21:57,920
go

1733
01:22:02,980 --> 01:22:01,340
one last thing here which is to make

1734
01:22:05,890 --> 01:22:02,990
sure that the outro music is playing at

1735
01:22:08,260 --> 01:22:05,900
least we'll actually play because you

1736
01:22:09,550 --> 01:22:08,270
know there's there's always that there's

1737
01:22:11,980 --> 01:22:09,560
always that chance it's it's kind of

1738
01:22:15,400 --> 01:22:11,990
like my am i closing parting tech gift

1739
01:22:19,360 --> 01:22:15,410
that OBS tends to give to me where oh my

1740
01:22:20,800 --> 01:22:19,370
goodness it's actually playing Walter I

1741
01:22:22,720 --> 01:22:20,810
wanted to thank you again very much for

1742
01:22:27,070 --> 01:22:22,730
joining us on the program this afternoon

1743
01:22:28,840 --> 01:22:27,080
and for just being awesome and being

1744
01:22:32,500 --> 01:22:28,850
forthright with your answers thank you

1745
01:22:34,890 --> 01:22:32,510
thank you I you may not have people may

1746
01:22:37,020 --> 01:22:34,900
not agree with what I say but I

1747
01:22:40,050 --> 01:22:37,030
I am being honest and sincere when I put

1748
01:22:42,030 --> 01:22:40,060
stuff out there I like to I don't like

1749
01:22:43,950 --> 01:22:42,040
to bamboozle paper and that's

1750
01:22:47,160 --> 01:22:43,960
appreciated my name is Chris George

1751
01:22:49,649 --> 01:22:47,170
zuker this is denna floor episode 105 a

1752
01:22:52,589 --> 01:22:49,659
Thursday August 8 2018

1753
01:22:54,810 --> 01:22:52,599
with none other than author screenwriter

1754
01:22:57,660 --> 01:22:54,820
and all-around spell chap

1755
01:23:01,020 --> 01:22:57,670
Walter Bosley ladies and gents if you

1756
01:23:02,070 --> 01:23:01,030
are a master level or above you know

1757
01:23:03,589 --> 01:23:02,080
we're gonna take a little bit of a short

1758
01:23:06,899 --> 01:23:03,599
break and then we're going to get into

1759
01:23:10,589 --> 01:23:06,909
the after show that'll be in about 7:30

1760
01:23:12,660 --> 01:23:10,599
and then after that an 8 o'clock on we

1761
01:23:15,390 --> 01:23:12,670
have this month's master class and it's

1762
01:23:17,939 --> 01:23:15,400
a secret one for you guys so you might

1763
01:23:19,979 --> 01:23:17,949
want to stick around ladies and gents my

1764
01:23:20,160 --> 01:23:19,989
name is Chris bird Zuger stay thirsty my

1765
01:24:06,250 --> 01:23:20,170
friends